S4, E3: Gịnị bụ ihe nketa gị? Jiri Sangeeta Waldron nyochaa mgbanwe zuru ụwa ọnụ

Ndebanye aha dijitalụ

[00:00:09] Jackie De Burca: Abụ m Jackie De Burca na taa enwere m ihe omume na-adọrọ mmasị na Sangeeta Waldron, onye na-agwa anyị okwu banyere akwụkwọ nke atọ ya, "Gịnị Ga-abụ Ihe Nketa Gị? Mkparịta ụka ya na ndị na-agbanwe egwuregwu ụwa."

Na Sangeeta agwala ndị na-eme mgbanwe 36 okwu. Nhọrọ nke ndị mmadụ si gburugburu ụwa na-adọrọ mmasị ma dị ebube.

Ụfọdụ aha nwere ike mara ụfọdụ n'ime gị. Ma otu ga-fọrọ nke nta n'ezie. Nke a bụ Julian Lennon, onye bụ nwa John Lennon, mana ọ bụ onye na-ese ihe na onye na-eme ihe n'ikike nke aka ya.

Enwere m mmasị dị ukwuu maka ọrụ Sangeeta.

O tinyela aka n'iwulite akara olu Constructive Voices, nke anyị nwere ekele maka ya.

Sangeeta, ọ bụ ihe obi ụtọ iso gị kparịta ụka taa.

[00:01:01] Sangeeta Waldron: Oh, mụ onwe m, Jackie. Daalụ maka ọmarịcha mmeghe dị otú ahụ ma ọ dị mma ịlaghachi na mkparịta ụka gị.

[00:01:08] Jackie De Burca: Thank you so much, Sangeeta. So would you like to elaborate a little bit more on your career, you know, where you are to date, first of all, about your PR work and of course, then about your books.

[00:01:19] Sangeeta Waldron: O doro anya.

Ọ bụghị iji ụda ma ọ bụ tinye onye ọ bụla ụra, mana agafeela m afọ 30 na ọrụ nkwukọrịta na mmekọrịta ọha na eze. Amalitere m ọrụ m ọtụtụ, ọtụtụ ọnwa gara aga na-ede okwu na nkọwa maka onye isi ala gara aga, Prime Minister UK na ndị minista. Arụla m ọrụ maka ụfọdụ ụdị kachasị dị ịtụnanya, ụdị zuru ụwa ọnụ. Arụụrụ m onye isi obodo London mbụ, Ken Livingstone. Na 2009, m hiwere ụlọ ọrụ PR nke m, Serendipity. PR na mgbasa ozi. Serendipity bụ ihe m kwenyesiri ike na ya. Na 2009, mgbe m guzobere gị n'ụlọnga, ụwa na-aga site a zuru ụwa ọnụ nlaazu. Ma echere m, ọ bụrụ na m nwere ike ịlanarị nke a, mgbe ahụ enwere m ike ịlanarị ihe ọ bụla. Na ngwa ngwa n'ihu 2024. A ka m nọ ebe a na m na-eme nke ọma. Ma n’oge ahụ, kemgbe afọ 2009, edeela m akwụkwọ atọ. Akwụkwọ mbụ m bụ na mmekọrịta ọha na eze PR ma a na-akpọ ya Akwụkwọ Ọmụma PR. Nke ahụ bụkwa akwụkwọ gara mahadum dị n'ụwa ma ọ ka na-eme nke ọma. Ya mere. Oh, Chineke, ị maara, enweghị m ike icheta usoro oge ugbu a. Ma na 20, nke ọma, n'oge ọrịa na-efe efe ma ọ bụ. Ọ dị mma, ee, n'oge ọrịa na-efe efe, ebipụtara m akwụkwọ nke abụọ m, nke bụ Ọrụ Ndị Ọrụ Na-ahụ Maka Ọrụ abụghị Mmekọrịta Ọha.

Nke ahụ bụkwa akwụkwọ gbasara ịsa ahịhịa.

And that book was so timely. And relevant, and is still relevant into day’s conversations about what companies are doing and how companies are behaving. And that book was shortlisted for the Business book awards in 2022 and now in 2025, I will be publishing my third book on the 30th of January. And that book is a continuation of the conversation I had in my second book. And this one is looking at the climate crisis. And the book is called what will your legacy be? Global conversations with change makers. And I’ve interviewed 36 thought leaders, business leaders, community leaders from around the world. I have Julian Lennon in the book, I have a NASA scientist, a researcher who’s looking into humpback whales. So the book has got different themes and importantly, there’s a takeaway for the reader at the end of every chapter to hopefully create a more of a pro planet habit and mindset. So that’s me in a nutshell, Jackie.

[00:04:30] Jackie De Burca: Ya mere, Sangeeta, echere m na nke ahụ bụ mmeghe mara mma na enwere m ekele maka ya. Ọ na-enye echiche zuru ụwa ọnụ nke ọma maka ọrụ gị na akwụkwọ. Ka anyị banye ozugbo banye n'akwụkwọ ọhụrụ gị, biko gwa anyị, kedu ihe nketa gị ga-abụ? Mkparịta ụka na ndị na-agbanwe egwuregwu ụwa gbasara nsogbu ihu igwe. Kedu ihe kpaliri gị ide ya na mbụ, Sangeeta?

[00:04:55] Sangeeta Waldron: Nke ahụ bụ ajụjụ dị mma, Jackie. M ga-alaghachikwa ihe dị ka otu afọ na ọkara gara aga na onye nkwusa m Martin gwara m, Sangeeta, ka anyị gaa rie nri ehihie. O wee sị m, echere m na ị dịla njikere ide akwụkwọ nke atọ gị. M wee sị, ị maara ihe, Martin? Echere m na m ziri ezi? Echere m na m dị njikere n'ihi na m na-eche echiche banyere ụfọdụ echiche na m n'ezie na-eche banyere nsogbu ihu igwe na ihe na-eme na otú anyị niile nwere ike isi mee mgbanwe. Ma ebe ahụ ka echiche ahụ si malite. Na m chọrọ n'ezie. Achọrọ m ide akwụkwọ ebe anyị niile nwere ike wepụ ihe na ya. Yabụ na ọ bụghị naanị na-ekwu maka nsogbu ihu igwe, mana gịnị ka anyị niile nwere ike ime, n'agbanyeghị obere, n'agbanyeghị obere, na anyị nwere ike ime mgbanwe. N'ihi na m kwenyere na anyị niile nwere ike ime mgbanwe. Aga m ekwu otu ihe ọzọ. Ndị mmadụ na-ekwu mgbe niile, gịnị? Kedu ihe m nwere ike ịme? Kedu ihe otu onye nwere ike ime? Kedu ihe dị iche onye dị ka m nwere ike ime? M na-ekwukwa nke a mgbe niile, na, ị maara, otu omume nwere ike ịmepụta ọnyà na ndị na-agbakọta ọnụ na ọnụ anyị nwere ike ịmepụta tsunami. Ma na mbufịt mbufịt nwere ike ịbụ mmetụta dị mma ma bụrụ pro planet. Ya mere, nke ahụ bụ echiche n'ezie nke akwụkwọ ahụ.

[00:06:20] Jackie De Burca: Echere m, n'onwe ya, ọ dị ịtụnanya na o si na mkparịta ụka ahụ pụta. Mana o doro anya na onye nkwusa gị maara gị nke ọma ma dịrị njikere, ị mara, na oge ahụ zuru oke. Nke a abụrụlarị ihe na-etolite, ị mara, n'ime obi gị na mkpụrụ obi gị na uche gị na ihe ndị ọzọ. Echiche niile nke ihe nketa, Sangeeta, bụ isi na akwụkwọ ahụ, doro anya. Kedu ihe bụ echiche nke gị na ihe nketa? Kedu ihe ọ pụtara nye gị? Kedu otu esi akọwa echiche ahụ n'onwe gị?

[00:06:49] Sangeeta Waldron: Oh, nke ahụ bụ ezigbo ajụjụ, Jackie. Ma achọrọ m ikwu ihe. I kwuru otu ihe ka i webatara ajụjụ a, ị dabara nke ọma.

Ọ bụ ihe niile gbasara mmetụta, nke a. Njikọ a dị egwu. Enwere m echiche a, ekwenyere m na nke ọ bụla n'ime akwụkwọ m nwere ike nke ya na oge nke ya. Yabụ na achọrọ m ikwu nke ahụ.

Na ihe nketa, nye m nnukwu okwu. Mgbe m na-agbakwa ndị mmadụ ajụjụ ọnụ n’akwụkwọ ahụ, okwu ahụ n’onwe ya juru ụfọdụ ndị anya.

Mana maka m, echere m na ọ bụ naanị ịhapụ ụwa ka mma karịa ihe m chọtara ya. Ma ọ bụghị nanị na-ahapụ ya ka mma maka, ị maara, ise na-esote, afọ iri, ma maka. N'ihi na narị afọ sochirinụ, na-esote afọ 200, n'ihi na otú ahụ ka anyị kwesịrị ịdị na-eche echiche.

Ma ezi ihe atụ nke a bụ, ị mara, mgbe ị na-aga praịm, mgbe ụfọdụ ndị na-aga Primark ma ọ bụ mgbe ụfọdụ ndị na-aga ụfọdụ n'ime ndị a ngwa ngwa ejiji outlets na ha ga-azụta elu na mgbe ahụ ha ga-eche, ọ dị mma. , anyị achọghị elu ahụ ọzọ, ha ga-etinye ya n'ime ebe a na-ekpofu ahịhịa.

Mgbe ụfọdụ. Mgbe niile, elu ndị ahụ nwere ike were 100 afọ iji daa n'ihi na ha dị ọnụ ala ma jiri eriri rọba mee ha. Ya mere i chere na ọ bụ. Nke ahụ ga-abụ ihe nketa gị n'ime narị afọ na-abịa? Achọghị m ka ihe nketa m bụrụ nke ahụ. Achọrọ m ka ọ bụrụ ihe bara uru karịa.

I want it to make a difference to somebody in the future with the air they’re breathing, with the. And I hope that they’ll still be able to tap into nature that we have now. So, yes, it’s something deep for me.

[00:08:52] Jackie De Burca: Ee, echere m na nke ahụ doro anya. Site n'ọrụ gị ruo n'ụbọchị yana doro anya akwụkwọ ọhụrụ nke anyị na-atụle taa, kedu ka ị chere ọ nabatara ndị sonyere na nke ị gbara ajụjụ ọnụ? Ọ̀ bụụrụ ụfọdụ n'ime ha ihe na mbụ? Ọ bụ ihe na-emenye ha ike, ma ọ bụ ụfọdụ n'ime ha dị mma na ya, echiche dum nke ihe nketa?

[00:09:14] Sangeeta Waldron: Ee, ọ bụ ihe na-atọ ụtọ n'ezie n'ihi na m na-ajụ onye ọ bụla otu ajụjụ ahụ, nke bụ, gịnị, ga-, gịnị ka ị chọrọ ka ihe nketa gị bụrụ? Ajụrụ m ha nke ahụ na ngwụcha mkparịta ụka ọ bụla.

Ụfọdụ ndị mmadụ, ụfọdụ olu bụ, ee, amaghị m, nke ahụ bụ nnukwu ajụjụ, ma bụrụ naanị. Enwere m mmetụta nke ukwuu karịa ya. Ụfọdụ ndị abụghị n'ihi na ha chere na ha na-aga n'ihu ime ihe nketa na ha chọrọ ịga n'ihu n'ọrụ ha.

Mana ihe na-adọrọ mmasị bụ ihe fọrọ nke nta ka ọ bụrụ onye ọ bụla, ọbụlagodi ndị kwuru, oh, ọ bụ nnukwu ajụjụ, ma ọ bụ ndị kwuru, ị maara, anyị chọrọ ịga n'ihu. Nke a bụ otú anyị si ahụ ya, onye ọ bụla enweghị isi ma ọ bụ, ị maara, ọ dị ntakịrị na ntinye aka ha, nke m chọpụtara na e nwere nnukwu obi umeala na azịza ha. Achọpụtara m na nke ahụ, amaghị m, n'ụzọ dị ịtụnanya, na-enye ike. Ị mara, ego adịghị na nke a. Ọ bụ n'ezie naanị ime nke ọma na ime ya nke ọma.

[00:10:29] Jackie De Burca: Lee azịza magburu onwe ya. Yabụ na n'echiche, ọ na-abịakwute m na n'ezie, ndị mmadụ na-eche, oh, nke ọma, abụghị m Julian Lennon ma ọ bụ, ị maara, agaghị m akpọ ndị ọzọ niile aha, mana abụghị m onye. dị ka nke ahụ. Yabụ kedu ohere m nwere ma ọ bụrụ na ndị dị otú ahụ chere na ọ bụ nnukwu okwu. Mana n'ezie, ihe ị kwuru naanị ebe ahụ, Sangeeta, bụ. Ọ na-akpụ akpụ site ego na dị nnọọ na-agbalị na-egwu gị òkè, ihe ọ bụla size bụ, ma ọ bụrụ na ọ bụ n'ezie obere. Ma ọ bụ akụkụ nke foto zuru ezu, ọ́ bụghị ya?

[00:10:57] Sangeeta Waldron: N'ezie, ee. Nke ahụ bụkwa mmetụta ahụ. Enwere m mmetụta na m bụ akụkụ nke ihe, ị maara, site na ha. Ịdị umeala n'obi ha. Ọ dị m ka m so na nke ahụ. Abụ m akụkụ nke ihe karịrị onwe m.

Ọ dị nnọọ mma. Ọ bụ mmetụta na-enye ike. Na mgbe mkparịta ụka ọ bụla, enwere m olileanya na onye ọ bụla nwere olileanya na nke ahụ na nkwenye na anyị nwere ike ghara ịgbanwe ihe, ma anyị nwere ike ịchọta ngwọta maka nsogbu anyị.

[00:11:32] Jackie De Burca: N'ezie. Echere m na e nwere ọtụtụ ihe ngwọta dị mma nke a na-emegharị n'ebe dị iche iche n'oge a, yana ọtụtụ ikike na ohere. Ugbu a, o doro anya na ị jiri olu na-ewuli elu rụọ ọrụ na RPR n'oge anyị mbụ, yabụ ị mara anyị nke ọma karịa ọtụtụ ndị ọzọ gbara ajụjụ ọnụ. Sangeeta, ọ bụrụ na ị na-agbaso echiche nke ihe nketa nye ndị na-arụ ọrụ na gburugburu ebe obibi, kedu ka ị ga-esi mee ya? Ka ị ga-agbanwe ya ma ọlị?

[00:11:59] Sangeeta Waldron: Echere m na enwere ohere maka imeziwanye. Nke ahụ na-aga maka mpaghara ọ bụla na anyị nwere ike imeziwanye onwe anyị mgbe niile. Ma m na-eche n'ezie maka onye ọ bụla na a. Na-arụ ọrụ na-ewu, si n'elu na ala n'akụkụ, ndị mmadụ na-eme ihe niile admin stof, nke ahụ dịkwa mkpa n'ezie na-ewu n'ihi na onye ọ bụla dị nnọọ na-eche, otú anyị pụrụ nnọọ ime ya mma maka ụwa? Ị mara, anyị nwere ike iji karịa ihe na -adigide? Anyị nwere ike iche maka ụdọ ọkọnọ anyị? Anyị nwere ike iche maka ebe anyị na-ewu ụlọ na otu anyị si arụ ụlọ n'ime oghere ime obodo a. N'ezie, n'ime akwụkwọ ahụ, a na m agwa onye na-arụ ọrụ n'ime ụlọ ọrụ ihe owuwu, ọ na-ekwukwa banyere ihe niile dị ịtụnanya na-eme na ikekwe anyị dị ka ndị nkịtị amaghị nke ọma ma ọ bụ nwee ekele maka ya, dị ka Sangeeta.

[00:12:59] Jackie De Burca: Ya mere, ọ masịrị m ịbanye na nke ahụ n'ihi ndị na-ege anyị ntị.

[00:13:03] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah. So things such as there is now, there’s an app, I believe, where people can actually, when they’re building something, a site they can actually track to see what’s the carbon footprint of that piece of wood or those bricks or whatever that their. That those materials are coming from. There’s a lot of thought now being put into the architecture of a building, whether it’s a school, a shopping complex, a housing site. There’s a lot of thought going into that. And also from the builders, the people working on the site, there’s a lot of thought going into how they’re approaching that build. So I think that’s really interesting because we. I didn’t really appreciate that enough. And whether it’s a big venue for music or a sports stadium, those ụlọ a na-ewu ya na ebumnuche na ebumnuche maka obodo na maka okike.

[00:14:09] Jackie De Burca: Yes, there’s certainly an awful lot of positive changes. Again, lots of different apps and all sorts of initiatives and some of the leading companies are really working with nature mind now. So there is a huge amount of change going on at the moment. I don’t know if you remember or not from one of the panels that you sat on for Constructive Voices in the relatively early days, a gentleman called Neil Maxwell. And I’d like to mention him purely because he is a lovely example of somebody who had a very, very successful company in the built environment doing fit outs, a chap based in Liverpool. And he was making lots and lots of money until he went on a voyage to the Arctic. And then he came back a changed man and he set up Changing Streams. I don’t know if you remember him at all.

[00:15:01] Sangeeta Waldron: Ee, a na m eme.

[00:15:02] Jackie De Burca: Yabụ na ọ bụ ezigbo atụ nke onye ọ masịrị, were banye n'ụgbọ ihe na-eme. Ma ya, ị maara, ọ na-enweta nnukwu ego na ụlọ ọrụ ya. Echere m na ọ rere ụlọ ọrụ ya n'ikpeazụ wee guzobe Changing Streams. Na n'ebe ahụ n'isi afọ a, ha na-arụ ọrụ na-agbanwe agbanwe, nke aha ya, n'ezie, ga-enye gị echiche nke eziokwu ahụ bụ na, ee, ha na-achọ ịmepụta. Ha na-ewulite ihe enyemaka maka ndị nọ n'ime gburugburu ebe e wuru iji chọta ihe ndị ka mma maka gburugburu ebe obibi anyị na maka okike. Yabụ na enwere ọtụtụ ihe na-eme, Sangeeta, nke dị mma n'ezie. O doro anya na ndị niile ị gwara okwu n'akwụkwọ ahụ, ị ​​nwere olu iri atọ na isii. Ha dị nnọọ iche iche, doro anya na ndị mmadụ na-adọrọ mmasị, n'ezie. Kedu ka ị siri wee họrọ ndị ahụ yana ụdị isiokwu ị tụrụ anya inyocha site na akụkọ ha?

[00:15:55] Sangeeta Waldron: Ọfọn, m doro anya na isiokwu nke akwụkwọ ahụ. Ya mere, achọrọ m ikpuchi isiokwu sara mbara site na sayensị n'ihi na ọ bụ ebe ahụ ka ihe niile na-amalite na mkparịta ụka ihu igwe a.

Ọchịchị, ndu ụwa, azụmahịa, ụwa nke azụmahịa, nri, n'ihi na anyị niile metụtara nke ahụ. Anyị na-azụ ahịa ma ọ bụ, ịmara, anyị na-etinye nri na tebụl ma ọ bụ na anyị bụ, ụfọdụ n'ime anyị bụ ndị ọrụ ugbo, ndị na-emepụta ihe. Ya mere achọrọ m inyocha nri.

Mgbasa ozi na-arụ nnukwu ọrụ na obodo, n'ezie, na egwu na nka n'ihi na nke ahụ bụkwa akụkụ nke akụkọ n'ime mkparịta ụka ihu igwe. Ya mere enwere m isiokwu ndị a na enwekwara m isiakwụkwọ pụrụ iche na India n'ihi na ọ bụ ugbu a ọnụ ọgụgụ kasị ukwuu n'ụwa na ya dị ka mpaghara, maara nke ọma karịa onye ọ bụla banyere ihe ịma aka nke nsogbu ihu igwe. Ya mere enwere m isiokwu ndị a ma chọkwara m ịhụ na akwụkwọ ahụ jupụtara n'ụdị dị iche iche ma nwee nsonye. Ya mere iche iche na nsonye nke olu. N'ihi ya, achọrọ m ijide n'aka na anyị nwere, ma ọ bụ na m nwere ọtụtụ olu nwanyị na akwụkwọ ahụ na ndị si na obodo dị iche iche na nzụlite. Ma mgbe m na-enweghị ike ịhụ nwaanyị, m ga-ahụ na ọ bụ onye si n'ime obodo ma ọ bụ agbụrụ na-enye ndị dị iche iche olu. N'ihi na otu n'ime ihe ndị bụ isi, karịsịa na mba ndị na-emepe emepe, nke na-adaba na ya, nke ọma, nsogbu ihu igwe na-emetụta ha ogologo oge. Ị mara, ịlaghachi na 80s, 90s, ọ metụtara ha. Ugbu a n'ebe ọdịda anyanwụ, nsogbu ihu igwe na-emetụta anyị. Ma ha na-edi ihe na-emenụ ruo ogologo oge. Na ihe nyocha na-egosi bụ na ụmụ nwanyị bụ ndị mbụ na-emetụta ụdị ọdachi ihu igwe ọ bụla. N'ihi na mgbe niile ụmụ nwanyị na-anọ n'ụlọ.

Ya mere ọ bụrụ na ọ bụ mbufịt mbufịt ma ọ bụ oké ọkọchị, ọ bụ ha kacha emetụta. Ya mere, m chọrọ n'ezie inye echiche ahụ n'akwụkwọ ahụ.

[00:18:21] Jackie De Burca: Yabụ na ọ dị ka ị rụsiri ọrụ ike nke ukwuu naanị iji nweta ụdị olu dị iche iche maka ajụjụ ọnụ 36 gị.

[00:18:30] Sangeeta Waldron: Ee.

[00:18:31] Jackie De Burca: Mgbe ahụ ị ga-ede akwụkwọ mgbe nke ahụ gasịrị, doro anya.

[00:18:34] Sangeeta Waldron: Ee. Ọzọkwa, ị maara, naanị ileba anya na sayensị, anyị, ị maara, sayensị na-achị ụmụ nwoke. Ya mere, m chọrọ n'ezie ịchọta nwanyị, chọta ndị ọkà mmụta sayensị. Achọkwara m obi abụọ dị ịtụnanya, amamiihe.

One is a NASA scientist and she’s Dr. Kimberly Minor and she works in the Arctic region as well. And the other is Roberta Boscolo, who. Yes, so.

Ee. Ya mere enwere m obi ụtọ. Ahụrụ m ihe fọrọ nke nta ka ọ bụrụ n'isiakwụkwọ ọ bụla otu nwanyị inye echiche.

[00:19:16] Jackie De Burca: Nke ahụ dị egwu. Ugbu a, amaara m na nke a abụghị ka ọ dị ka akwụkwọ akụkọ nke awa ole na ole n'ogologo, nke ma eleghị anya ọ kwesịrị, ị maara, na-abanye n'ọkwa ahụ nke nkọwa ma eleghị anya n'oge ọzọ mgbe ewepụtara akwụkwọ ahụ n'ezie.

Yabụ na ọ ga-esiri gị ike ịza ajụjụ a n'ụzọ Sangeeta, mana ọ ga-amasị gị ịhọrọ ụfọdụ nghọta kachasị ịtụnanya ma ọ bụ na-akpali akpali nke ị mụtara na mkparịta ụka gị?

[00:19:40] Sangeeta Waldron: Amaara m ajụjụ aghụghọ dị ka ịhọrọ nwa m kacha mma. Ị maara, gịnị bụ nwa kacha amasị m?

M, ị maara, ihe m chọpụtara ma nọrọ na m bụ anwansi nke whale humpback.

And I spoke to this researcher, her name’s Rachel. And just, I mean, I’ll say this because I want people to buy the book and read what she says. But what is extraordinary and what I’ve. I’ve learned during this process of writing the book is that nature has provided everything for us. She has thought of everything. Everything in our ecosystem has a function and has a place, and it works to keep things in balance, from the Arctic to the Antarctic, to marine creatures living in our ocean and our seas, to what, the trees on the land. And unfortunately, it’s been us humans who’ve gone in and disrupted the balance. But even a species like the humpback whale plays a very important part in our survival.

Aga m ahapụ gị n'elu ugwu ugwu ahụ.

[00:21:03] Jackie De Burca: Definitely going to be reading the book. I would have done anyhow, in my case, because, you know, obviously I have a huge respect for your work, but, yes, that is a cliffhanger. Quite fascinating, obviously. The book includes interviews with personalities, as you’ve mentioned, ranging from the likes of, you know, Roberta Boscolo, who we both know, to musicians. And that means that there is such a broad range of perspectives going to be obviously there in the book. How do you feel that enriches the dialogue around climate change, Sangeeta?

[00:21:32] Sangeeta Waldron: Ọfọn, ị maara, dị ka mmadụ, anyị hụrụ akụkọ n'anya. Akụkọ bụ akụkụ nke DNA anyị, egwu na nka sokwa na nke ahụ. Ha bụ ihe ahụ. M na-agwakwa onye na-arụ ọrụ nkà n'akwụkwọ ahụ, ọ na-eme ihe osise na eserese ndị a dị egwu na-ejikọta gị na ihe na-eme n'oké osimiri na n'oké osimiri. Aga m ekwu nke a ngwa ngwa. M na-agwakwa onye na-ede abụ okwu. A na-akpọ ya Stevie Kalinich, ma ọ dị afọ 80 na-eto eto, Stevie na-edekwa akwụkwọ maka Beach Boys, onye na-ede abụ maka Beach Boys. Ọ na-ekwukwa maka otu n'ime egwu ya akpọrọ Little Bird. Na Ọzọ, ọ na-egosi gị otu egwu si ejikọta anyị na okike na mmụọ nke okike. Ugbu a UN nwekwara ọtụtụ atụmatụ iji ndị egwu na ndị nka na-enyere anyị aka inwe mmetụta nke njikọ na gburugburu anyị.

[00:22:38] Jackie De Burca: Nke ahụ dị ịtụnanya. Ya mere, echere m na nke ahụ nwere ike iduga anyị nke ọma. Ama m na ị pụghị ịhọpụta ụmụaka kacha amasị gị n'ime afọ 36, mana ka anyị kwuo maka nka na egwu na ihe ị maara nke ahụ na-emetụta ọtụtụ mmadụ. Ọ bụrụgodị na ha ejighị nkà ma ọ bụ egwu egwu egwu, ọtụtụ ndị na-enwe mmasị n'ụdị nkà ma ọ bụ egwú ụfọdụ. Yabụ kedu ụdị iwere ihe anyị nwere n'akwụkwọ sitere na mpaghara ndị ahụ?

[00:23:05] Sangeeta Waldron: Ọfọn, ị maara, n'ezie egwu na-aga azụ. M na-ekwu ụzọ azụ, ọ bụghị na-agbalị ka anyị na-akpa. Jackie ebe a.

[00:23:13] Jackie De Burca: Kpachara anya, Sangeeta.

[00:23:16] Sangeeta Waldron: Ị na-aga na 50s na 60s, enwere egwu n'ebe ahụ na-ekwu maka mgbanwe ihu igwe n'oge ahụ, na-agbalị ime ka anyị jikọọ, jikọọ na okike na iche echiche banyere ụwa anyị. N’ihi ya, e nwere ọtụtụ abụ ndị a ma ama, egwú ndị a ma ama, ma enwere m ndepụta ụfọdụ n’ime abụ ndị ahụ n’akwụkwọ ahụ. Ma, ị maara, ọ bụrụgodị na ị bụ. Ọ bụrụ na ị na-adịghị amasị art na ị na-adịghị amasị ịga veranda, ma m n'aka na ị ga-agụ ihe ma ọ bụ na ị ga-ahụ foto nke ihe, na ndị foto na-emepụta mmetụta n'ime anyị. Ma ọ bụrụ. Cheedị ma ọ bụrụ na ịnweghị ike ịpụ nụ nchara nke akwụkwọ osisi ma ọ bụ ụda ebili mmiri, nke bụkwa egwu. Ọ bụ egwu okike.

Ị pụghị ịpụ gaa n'ogige ntụrụndụ dị n'ógbè gị wee gbaa bọọlụ gburugburu ma ọ bụ na-eje ije na ogige ahụ n'ihi na ọ dịghịzi. Kedu ihe anyị ga-esere n'ọdịnihu? Kedu ihe nka anyị ga-abụ? Kedu ihe anyị ga-atụ anya na ụlọ akwụkwọ ndị ahụ? Ma ọ bụrụ na anyị enweghịzi egwu, gịnị ka anyị ga na-ege na Spotify ma ọ bụ na redio? Ọ ga-abụ naanị ịgbachi nkịtị. Ya mere echere m na enwere njikọ dị ukwuu na egwu, nka, ihe anyị na-ekiri, ihe anyị na-agụ na okike. Ọdịdị na-akpali anyị.

Na nke ahụ bụkwa otu n'ime isi ihe m na-amụta n'aka ndị nka a na ndị edemede na ndị na-ede abụ bụ otú ọdịdị na-akpali ha.

Site na nke ahụ, enwere m olile anya na a ga-akpali mmụọ ime mgbanwe na okike n'onwe ya.

[00:25:07] Jackie De Burca: N'ezie Sangeet. M                                ይን g  n'ihe na-abata m n’obi b ikpuchi nd ah na-echegh na  magh im. Oh, anaghị m enweta nkà n'ezie ma ọ bụ anaghị m agụ akwụkwọ ma ọ bụ ihe ọ bụla. Ma ọtụtụ ndị ga-ele anya. Na anyị agaghị akpọ ọzọ nnukwu ika ebe a. Mana ndị mmadụ ga-ele anya ma ọ dịkarịa ala ihe nkiri na usoro ihe nkiri na telivishọn ha ma na-asọpụrụ ma soro ihe ọ bụla ha na-eme n'ezie. Ya mere, n'ụzọ ụfọdụ, echere m na ọ bụrụ na ị malite iwepụta ihe ndị ahụ, dị ka anyị na-ewere ejighị ya kpọrọ ihe, ihe nkiri ndị anyị na-ahụ na fim anyị hụrụ n'anya ma ọ bụ na usoro TV anyị na-eso, dị ka pasent X nke ndị ahụ. na-abịa site na okike. Ma ọ bụrụ na ọdịdị adịghịzi adị, agaraghị eme fim ahụ anyị hụrụ n'anya na mbụ.

[00:25:51] Sangeeta Waldron: 100.

Ee. Kedu ihe anyị ga-ele anya? Ihuenyo oghere? Ma ọ bụ anyị ga-eche, Chineke m, otu ahụ ka ọ dịbu na nke a bụ ugbu a.

Yeah. So we want to save those green spaces. We want to, you know, look after our parks. We want to take our rubbish home. We want to make sure we’re not filling our ocean and our seas with plastic. So otherwise it will be a very different kind of painting. But we’re actually seeing some of that being now written into our music and drawn into our art. How these things are changing the landscape.

[00:26:36] Jackie De Burca: Ee. Nke dịkwa mkpa n'ezie, echere m, na-agụghị akwụkwọ ahụ ruo ugbu a, Sangeeta, otu n'ime ihe na-abata n'uche bụ onyinye nkwurịta okwu gị, otu i si ejikọta akwụkwọ ahụ. N'ụzọ doro anya, ị na-akpali ndị na-agụ akwụkwọ gị nke ukwuu ka ha mara mgbanwe ihu igwe. Ị naghị agbalị ịkụ ọkpọ, ịmara, ruo na nkuzi. A na-eme ya site n'ịkọ akụkọ. Site na ịkọ akụkọ na olu 36 dị iche iche na onwe gị, na-ejikọta ya niile ma na-ekwurịta ya. Kedu ụdị usoro ị na-eche na ndị na-agụ akwụkwọ gị nwere ike ime ma emesịa iji nye aka na nkwado?

[00:27:17] Sangeeta Waldron: Enwere ọtụtụ ihe dị mfe, dị mfe ka anyị mee. M pụtara, e nwere ihe ndị ị na-adịghị ọbụna na-eme, dị ka, ime. Ị maara? Ọ bụ naanị otu n'ime ihe kacha mkpa anyị nwere ike ime, nke bụ ihe anyị na-eme ugbu a, n'etiti anyị, mụ na gị na-ekwu maka ya. Na-ekwu maka nsogbu ihu igwe na-ekwurịta banyere ya na ndị ọzọ. Soro ndị ọrụ ibe gị kwurịta ya na-arụ ọrụ, soro ụmụ klas gị kwurịta ya, ndị enyi gị, n'ihi na nke ahụ na-eme ka mmadụ mara. Na mmata na-abịa mgbanwe.

Ihe ndị ọzọ dị nta ị nwere ike ime bụ mgbe ị na-ehicha ezé gị, ekwela ka mgbata ahụ na-agba ọsọ, chekwaa mmiri, n'ihi na mmiri na-aghọzi ihe dị oké ọnụ ahịa. Ọfọn, ọ dị oké ọnụ ahịa. E nwekwara ọnụ ọgụgụ na-ekwu na mmiri na-eji nwayọọ nwayọọ na-agwụ. Ya mere, obere ihe ndị dị otú ahụ na-etinye mkpuchi gị na saucepan ga-azọpụta mmiri.

Kedu ihe ọzọ m nwere ike ịgwa gị? Ọbụna ịga ije na ogige ahụ na-ejikọta gị na okike ma nyere gị aka inwe mmetụta nke mmụọ nsọ ime mgbanwe. Na-eburu ihe mkpofu gị n'ụlọ. Ahapụla ya na ogige. Chee echiche banyere ịghara iji karama rọba, mana were. Were karama mmiri a ga-ejupụta nke gị. Ihe ndị a niile na-agbakwunye ma na-eme mgbanwe.

[00:28:41] Jackie De Burca: Ha na-eme nke ọma. Ugbu a, Sangeeta, Ilaghachi na isiokwu 36 gị ma ọ bụ ndị gbara ajụjụ ọnụ n'akwụkwọ ahụ, ị ​​chere na ọ ga-eju ndị na-agụ gị anya ma na-akpali mmụọ ma ọ bụ iju gị anya? Kedu ụdị mmetụta ị na-atụ anya ịchọta n'aka ndị na-agụ akwụkwọ n'ọdịnihu nke akwụkwọ ọhụrụ gị?

[00:29:05] Sangeeta Waldron: Ihe ndị ahụ niile. N'ike mmụọ nsọ, akpata oyi. Oo chimoo. Amaghị m nke ahụ. Echere m, a na m agwakwa onye isi ala ezumike nka a lara ezumike nka ka m kwuo maka otu onye ndu si bụrụ akụkụ nke mkparịta ụka ihu igwe yana etu esi agbanwe usoro agha n'ihi mgbanwe ihu igwe. M pụtara, e nwere ọtụtụ ihe na akwụkwọ. E nwekwara banyere nri.

Mgbe anyị gara nnukwu ụlọ ahịa mpaghara a, anyị nwere ike iche, ee, mango nọ ebe a. Mana ole n'ime anyị na-aghọta n'ezie na mgbe mango dị n'oge na mango ahụ e gbuturu nke ọma ma dị na obere ngwugwu rọba ahụ mara mma, gịnị bụ akara ụkwụ carbon ahụ. Yabụ, ee, yabụ m bụ naanị. Ee, enwere ọtụtụ ihe. Naanị n'ezie.

[00:29:57] Jackie De Burca: Ugbu a, ị kpọtụrụ onye ndu ndị agha mbụ nọ ebe ahụ na ajụjụ m, n'ihi na echere m na nke ahụ na-adọrọ mmasị ma ọ ga-amasị m ịbanye na nke ahụ na gị. Ị nwere ike ịkọwatụ ntakịrị na mkparịta ụka ahụ? N'ihi na echere m na nke ahụ dịkwa mma na ndị mmadụ. Ee.

[00:30:16] Sangeeta Waldron: Ya mere, mgbe m na-ede akwụkwọ ahụ, m na-ekwu, anyị nwere. Ọfọn, anyị ka na-aga n'ihu ma ugbu a, anyị nwere, ị maara, esemokwu Ukraine na Russia, ma ugbu a anyị nwere ihe na-eme na Middle East. Ma anyị anaghị aghọta na enwekwara mmetụta na agha na ihu igwe.

Ya mere, mgbe m na-ede akwụkwọ ahụ, echere m, Chineke, ị maara, ọ dị m mkpa itinye ihe ọ bụla gbasara ihe na-eme n'ụwa ugbu a. Ma ya. Agaghị m abanye n'ime nkọwa ahụ, mana enwere nnukwu obi iru ala nke mere ka m kwuo okwu na nke a.

[00:30:53] Jackie De Burca: Gini mere na o jughi m anya? Sangeeta.

[00:30:58] Sangeeta Waldron: Ọ. Ma ọ bụ n'ezie. Na kwa mgbe m na-agba ya ajụjụ ọnụ n'otu ụbọchị ahụ, onye nlekọta nwere akụkọ a banyere usoro agha na-agbanwe site na mgbanwe ihu igwe, nsogbu ihu igwe. Ya mere ọ ga-eme. Ọ dị ka ọ bịara n'oge, ọ dabara n'ezie. Achọghịkwa m inwe spo ọ bụla. Achọghị m inye ndị na-emebi ihe, mana enwere. Ụzọ ndị agha si abịara onwe ha ka ha bụrụ ngwọta maka ihu igwe. Nsogbu ihu igwe bụ ihe ijuanya n'ihi na ihe anyị na-aghọtaghị bụ tankị na-eji mmanụ ọkụ. Ogwe aka ndị a niile nwere akara carbon. Ya mere, ndị agha na-eche echiche nke ụzọ dị iche iche iji belata akara ụkwụ carbon nke ha, nke m chere na ọ bụ ihe na-egbu egbu n'ihi na anyị abụghị n'ezie, ị maara, dị nnọọ n'èzí, anyị anaghị aghọta nke ahụ. Nakwa otú Ukraine, nke ọma, na, Russian esemokwu nke ihe na-eme, otú nke ahụ na-agbanwekwa tactics na ihe na-eme n'akụkụ ụfọdụ nke ụwa.

Na-edu ndú, ị maara, otú mkpa ndu dị n'ime nke a, ọ bụghị naanị agha maara ihe, kamakwa ndọrọ ndọrọ ọchịchị.

Ihe ndị a niile jikọtara ya na anyị adịghị eche na ha dị, na ha dị, mana ha dị. N'ezie, ha niile bụ, enwere ọtụtụ ntụpọ na-esonye na nke a. Ee, achọpụtara m na ndị agha chọrọ ka a hụ ha, ọ bụghị naanị ka a hụ ha, ka ha na-eme nke ọma site na mbara ala, mana ha chọrọ n'ezie, ha na-eche n'ezie banyere ya ma na-eme mgbanwe ndị a na ha nwere akwụkwọ ndụ akwụkwọ ndụ ndị a. Mkparịta ụka WhatsApp na-aga.

[00:32:50] Jackie De Burca: Ọ dị mma, nke ahụ dị mma.

Nke ahụ bụ n'ezie, ee, ee, nke ahụ bụ n'ezie, n'ezie, dị mma n'ezie ịnụ. Echere m na ọkwa dị oke mkpa, ọ bụrụ na ịhọrọ ịlụ ọgụ maka obodo gị, nke ọma, gịnị kpatara na ị gaghị alụ ọgụ maka Mother Earth? Echere m. Ee.

[00:33:07] Sangeeta Waldron: Ma mụ onwe m, n'ụzọ na-akpali mmasị, enwere m ụdị ajụjụ ahụ, mana m na-edozi ya dịtụ iche n'akwụkwọ ahụ. Ị mara, mgbe ị na-alụ ọgụ maka obodo, kedu ka nke ahụ si eme, gịnị ka nke ahụ pụtara? N'ihi na ọ bụrụ na ị na-ele na uk, eze bụ nnọọ pro planet. Ee. Ị mara, ọ bụ, ọ raara onwe ya nye ndụ ya ịbụ pro planet. Ma ị nwere ike ịnwe ọchịchị na-eyighị ka mbara ụwa dị mma. Yabụ kedu ka ị mere dịka onye agha? Ị na-ese okwu? Kedu ka nke ahụ si arụ ọrụ? Ị mara, ọchịchị gị nke ụbọchị nwere ike ọ bụghị pro planet, ma gị, gị, gị eze bụ.

Ya mere. Ee, yabụ m na-enyocha ụfọdụ n'ime echiche ahụ n'ime akwụkwọ ahụ.

[00:33:54] Jackie De Burca: No, but it does sound fascinating. Just going back to your point about fuel in the military. I literally thought yesterday we have a lot more small planes flying around where I am in Spain to check that we haven’t got fires because now is the burning season. This is the time of the year where farmers are allowed to burn whatever, you know, that they need, they feel they need to burn.

[00:34:16] Sangeeta Waldron: Ee.

[00:34:17] Jackie De Burca: Ma enwere m otu echiche ahụ. Ọ dị m ka, nke ahụ dị mma na ha dị, na ha na-enyocha na anyị agaghị aga, ị mara, na-agba ọkụ. Ma ọnụ ahịa mmanụ ụgbọala ndị ahụ na-eme nke ahụ bụ nnukwu ego na gburugburu ebe obibi.

[00:34:32] Sangeeta Waldron: Ma m, m pụtara, anyị enweghị azịza niile, ị maara, ya mere, anyị na-eme ihe kasị mma nke ihe anyị nwere.

Yabụ ma eleghị anya n'ọdịnihu, amaghị m, ikekwe ọ nwere ike ịbụ drones ma ọ bụ ụzọ ọzọ.

Ọ nwere ike ịbụ satịlaịtị ịlele. M pụtara, a bụ m, ị maara, teknụzụ na-agbanwe mgbe niile, mana anyị ekwesịghị ịdabere naanị na ngwọta ndị na-abịa site na teknụzụ. O kwesịkwara ịbụ ihe anyị niile na-eme n'otu n'otu. Echere m na nke ahụ bụ otu n'ime ihe na-alaghachi na mkparịta ụka ndị agha bụ, ị maara, anyị na-echefu ndị ọrụ agha bụ mmadụ na ha bụkwa, ha nwere ezinụlọ na ha na-echekwa maka ọdịnihu na ihe nketa ha. 'na-apụ.

Ya mere, ihe niile ejikọrọ, ọ dịghị ihe dị iche?

[00:35:31] Jackie De Burca: Ee e. Ugbu a, echere m na e nyere ndepụta aha ma anyị achọghị inwe ụmụ kachasị amasị m, mana echere m na aha nke ọtụtụ ndị mmadụ ga-ama nke ọma ga-abụ Julian. Lennon, onye na-ede abụ n'onwe ya na n'ezie, nwa John Lennon. Anyị nwere ike nwee ntakịrị mkparịta ụka banyere ihe mkparịta ụka gị na Julian welitere?

[00:35:54] Sangeeta Waldron: Ihe na-adọrọ mmasị bụ Julian Lennon bụ onye guzobere otu nzukọ a na-akpọ ntọala White Feather. Ha na-arụkwa ọrụ dị ukwuu, na-arụ ọrụ na mbara ala ma jikọọ ntụpọ. Ya mere, ọ na-arụ ọrụ dị ukwuu site na ịkwalite ụmụ agbọghọ n'ihi na ụmụ nwanyị na-ebute ụzọ emetụta, karịsịa na ndịda zuru ụwa ọnụ na mgbanwe ihu igwe. Ọ na-ejikwa nkà nke ya, nke bụ foto na nka, na-egosi na inye nghọta dị iche na mkparịta ụka ihu igwe. Ma echere m na nke ahụ na-atọ ụtọ n'ezie n'ihi na nka na foto nwere ike ibupụta ọtụtụ ihe dị iche iche.

Ma ọ na-eji nke ya, m ga-asị na ọ bụghị nke ahụ, ị ​​maara, ọ bụghị ileda ọnọdụ a niile anya, mana ya, ọ nwere ọkwa onye ama ama na ọ na-eji ya, olu ya na mpaghara a. Ma ọ bụkwa, ịmara, maka ọtụtụ ndị a ma ama, mgbe ha na-ekwu maka mgbanwe ihu igwe ma ọ bụ nsogbu ihu igwe, a na-ekpe ha ikpe, a na-emechi ha.

Yabụ na ọ naghị adị mfe mgbe niile itinye isi gị n'elu ihe mgbochi. Ma ọ bụ ya. Echere m na anyị chọrọ, anyị kwesịrị, amaara m, echere m na anyị kwesịrị ịja nke ahụ n'ihi na ọ bụghị ọtụtụ ndị nwere obi ike ime ya. Ma ọ na-arụ ụfọdụ ọmarịcha ọrụ. Ụlọ ọrụ ya na-arụkwa ọrụ nke ọma na ọ bụ ọrụ dị mkpa. Yabụ na ọ bụghị naanị otu agbapụ. Ha na-emepụta ihe nketa n'ezie ma ha na ọtụtụ obodo ndị amaala na-arụkọ ọrụ.

And again, it brings it back to, you know, these indigenous communities hold the wisdom of ecosystems. And again, it all links to one of the conversations I have in the science chapter and how science is now using the wisdom of indigenous cultures to fit the missing piece of the puzzle within their own scientific work. So, yeah, it’s fascinating.

[00:38:12] Jackie De Burca: Ọ na-adọrọ mmasị nke ukwuu. Ma n'ezie, echere m site na ihe niile ị na-ekwu, Sangeeta, na ihe m kwenyere na ị bụ, ị maara, na-aga n'ihu na akwụkwọ gị, ị na-ekwu eziokwu ahụ bụ na e nwere ngwakọta nke ngwa ngwa na ngwa ngwa. nchekwube n'oge. Kedu otu ị ga-esi jikwaa dozie mmetụta ndị ahụ dị n'akwụkwọ ahụ?

[00:38:31] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah, really good question. And I guess I will. I will answer this by going to one of the conversations I had in the book with a scientist, and I asked him, do you ever feel overwhelmed with what you’re seeing? Because scientists are also dealing with something called climate grief. And he said, I have hope and belief to make the changes that we need, because it’s the hope and the belief that will get us up every day to do the work that we need to do. And there is still a lot of potential out there to make the changes that we need. And that’s echoed throughout the book and throughout every conversation that I have, that there are parts of the world that actually have all the solutions, like places like Africa, that we’ve not really invested in and what the solutions they could be providing. So, yes, I mean, there is. I really have. After every conversation I had with different thought leaders, experts, I always felt, oh, my God, there is hope here. There is people actually doing stuff. And that is in itself, you feel part of a bigger picture. And there is a bigger picture.

[00:39:51] Jackie De Burca: Ee. M ga-ajụ gị gbasara ọrụ olile anya, mana, m na-ekwu, ị zaghachila nke ahụ n'ụzọ zuru oke. N'ihi na ọ bụrụ na mgbe niile 36 ajụjụ ọnụ, ị chere banyere ịbụ akụkụ nke a ibu picture na-egwu gị ọrụ na olileanya ịbụ integral na ndị niile, m na-eche na nke ahụ bụ, ị maara, nke ahụ bụ nnọọ nti ozi ọma.

[00:40:10] Sangeeta Waldron: Ee. N'ihi na gịnị, ị maara, dịka ị kwuru nke ahụ, Jackie, ma ị chịkọta ya nke ọma, o mere ka m chee, ịkwesighi ịbụ ọkachamara n'ihe oriri, ị maara, ọkà mmụta sayensị nri iji mee mgbanwe. Eziokwu na ị. Anyị niile na-amata ihe anyị na-azụta na-eme ka anyị bụrụ akụkụ nke ngwọta ahụ na ịkwesighi ịbụ onye na-ede abụ iji mee mgbanwe n'ụwa. Eziokwu ahụ bụ na anyị na-ege egwu egwu ahụ na-enyere anyị aka inwe mmetụta nke njikọ na okike. Ya mere, ihe ndị a niile na-ekere òkè na ihe niile jikọtara.

[00:40:41] Jackie De Burca: Ejikọtara ihe niile. M n'ezie na-aga banyere, dị nnọọ n'ihi na anyị skimmed n'elu ya pụtara ngwa ngwa, na White feather ntọala bụ onye na Julian Lennon abuana ke. , ọrụ dị mma ha na-arụ. M chere dị ka onye na-ede akwụkwọ na ọ bụghị. Ọ bụghị na isiokwu a, echere m na ị nwere ihe ịma aka gị n'oge usoro ahụ dum, Angita, kedu ihe ha bụ na olee otu i siri merie ha?

[00:41:10] Sangeeta Waldron: Nke ahụ bụ ajụjụ dị mma, Jackie. M pụtara, ọ na-ewepụta oge na ndị mmadụ.

Also, when you’re writing the conversation, I felt, well, I’m sure all authors and all writers feel this. Journalists as well. You want to do justice to what you’ve written or the conversation you’ve had. You want that piece to be the best. And that’s hard because sometimes how you’ve interpreted a conversation doesn’t always mean that that person likes how they come across.

Yabụ na ị ga-ewepụ ego gị na usoro ahụ. Site na. Nke ahụ bụ ihe ịma aka. Ị maara, nke ahụ. Oh, Chineke. Ị maara, ọ̀ bụ na ọ masịghị ha? Ha emeela mgbanwe ndị a. Ọ bụghị gbasara m. Ma ọ bụ. Ọ bụ naanị, ịmara, emela m ihe kacha mma. Ya mere, ọ bụghị inwe mmetụta. Ọ bụghị inwe mmetụta. Obi abụọ. Enwela obi abụọ. Enweghị m ike. Achọghị m inwe obi abụọ n'onwe m na usoro ahụ, mana ọ na-esiri m ike ịghara ime ya.

Ma, ị maara, enwetala m n'akwụkwọ 4. N'isiakwụkwọ ọ bụla, enwere m mkparịta ụka anọ dị iche iche n'akwụkwọ ahụ. Ọ bụ ọtụtụ ederede. Ọ bụ nnukwu ọrụ. Ọ na-adịkwa ka ọ naghị akwụsị mgbe ụfọdụ.

Ya mere, ọ bụ ihe ịma aka nke, ị maara. Ị mara, mgbe ndị mmadụ na-alọghachi ma tinye ntakịrị na iberibe ka ha ghara iche na ha na-edozi ọrụ gị.

Nke ahụ nwere ike ịbụ ihe ịma aka n'ihi na ị maara, ị na-etinye obi gị na mkpụrụ obi gị n'ime ederede. Ihe ịma aka ndị ọzọ bụ iwepụta oge na ndị mmadụ.

Ndị mmadụ na-arụsi ọrụ ike mgbe ahụ. Ọ bụ naanị ihe ndị ahụ. M na-edekwa akwụkwọ a mgbe m na-eme ihe ọ bụla ọzọ. Yabụ na-arụ ọrụ, ndụ ụlọ, nri, ihicha, ị maara.

[00:43:01] Jackie De Burca: Kpọmkwem. Ee.

[00:43:02] Sangeeta Waldron: Ma mgbe ụfọdụ, a na m etinye akwụkwọ mpịakọta ma ọ ga-abụ 6:00.

[00:43:08] Jackie De Burca: Ee, mmadụ kwesịrị iri nri abalị.

[00:43:10] Sangeeta Waldron: Kpọmkwem.

[00:43:10] Jackie De Burca: Ime nri abalị. Kpọmkwem.

[00:43:13] Sangeeta Waldron: Oh, Chineke, a nọ m na mpịakọta ebe a. Achọghị m ịkwụsị naanị.

Ya mere ọ ga-adị. Enwere m ike ịnweta enyemaka ebe a?

Yabụ, ee. Ya mere, ọ bụ ụdị ahụ niile.

[00:43:25] Jackie De Burca: Ee.

[00:43:25] Sangeeta Waldron: Echere m na nke ahụ bụ nnukwu ihe bụ, ịmara, ị na-eme ya ka ị ka na-ebi ma na-aga n'ihu na ndụ na ọrụ.

[00:43:38] Jackie De Burca: Ọ bụ ya. M pụtara, ọ dịghị ihe na-ezere nke ahụ. Mana dịka ị kwugoro ugboro abụọ n'oge mkparịta ụka anyị, Sangeeta, ihe niile jikọtara ọnụ. Ya mere, echere m na nri ahụ ị na-enye na n'otu oge ahụ na-enweta site n'aka ezinụlọ nke gị na site na nri ị na-anọdụ ala ma nwee ọnụ nwere ike na-azụghachi n'ime mkpụrụ obi gị ọzọ na obi gị. Ma n'agbanyeghị na m maara dị ka onye na-emepụta ihe ọ dị ka agbaji site na ntinye ihe okike, ọ dị egwu. Mana n'otu ụzọ ahụ, ọ ga-adị mkpa ka ewepụ gị na ya mgbe ụfọdụ anyị agaghị eme ya. O nwere oge anyị na-agaghị eme ya n'ihi na anyị na-akpụ akpụ. Mana enwere ike inwe ntakịrị nri n'ụzọ nke ya. N'agbanyeghị ma eleghị anya ọ na-esi ike na.

[00:44:14] Sangeeta Waldron: Oge, ị maara, ọ bụ eziokwu. Ị marakwa, mgbe ụfọdụ ị. Aga m ezumike, m ga-alaghachi azụ, echere m, ee, ị maara, enwere m ike ime nke ọma. Achọrọ m ka isiakwụkwọ ahụ dị iche.

Ya mere nkwụsịtụ dị mma n'ihi na ọ na-enye gị oge ịtụgharị uche.

[00:44:30] Jackie De Burca: Ee, ekwenyere m kpamkpam. Ekwenyere m kpamkpam. Ugbu a, ịlaghachi n'ọrụ mbụ gị, ọrụ mmekọrịta ọha na eze na ọ bụghị mmekọrịta ọha na eze, ị chere na ọ bụ akwụkwọ dị iche n'ụzọ doro anya, mana ị na-eche na ị na-arụ ọrụ na isiokwu site na ọrụ a ma ọ bụ na ọ bụghị?

[00:44:45] Sangeeta Waldron: Ee, nke ukwuu. Amụtara m ọtụtụ ihe site na usoro ahụ nke ide akwụkwọ ahụ. Mana ejikọtakwara isiokwu ndị ahụ ọzọ n'ihi na akwụkwọ ahụ lekwasịrị anya na azụmahịa ndị na-eme nke ọma site na mbara ala. Na m ụdị inyocha na n'ụzọ dị iche na nke a ugbu a akwụkwọ banyere ọrụ nke azụmahịa na otú ihu igwe na-emetụta azụmahịa nakwa na ọkọnọ mgbanwe, ndo, na ọkọnọ yinye na ihe onwunwe, ihe. Mana ka ihu igwe si emetụta azụmahịa n'ụwa niile ebe ndị ọrụ nwere ike ọ gaghị enwe ike ịbanye n'ihi na ọ na-ekpo oke ọkụ ma ọ bụ ebe idei mmiri juru.

Ee, ọtụtụ, ị maara, azụmahịa ugbu a na-emetụta ihu igwe n'ezie na nke ahụ na-akpata. Nke ahụ nwere ike ịkpata ihe ịma aka mmepụta. Na kwa nke ahụ, ị ​​maara, ọ nwere ike ịbụ azụmahịa na-arụ ọrụ ebe a na-adabere na, amaghị m, ihe sitere na mpaghara ọzọ nke dịworo. Ọnọdụ ihu igwe emetụtala mpaghara ahụ. Ya mere, ha enweghị ike imepụta n'ihi na ha anaghị enweta ihe ha.

[00:46:08] Jackie De Burca: Ee, mba, ọ bụ nnukwu, Ọ bụ nnukwu isiokwu. Ugbu a, m dị ihe dị ka otu awa n'ebe ndịda Valencia na m wee na nnukwu ụlọ ahịa n'ụbọchị na-esote, ị maara, kasịnụ nke Dana na dị ka ọ na-adịghị ọbụna mere m na anyị na-ahụ mmetụta ya ebe a n'ihi na m adịghị eche echiche otú ahụ. Ma nri gị niile dị ọhụrụ adịghị adị. Enweghị mkpụrụ osisi na veggies ọ bụla. Ọ dịghị ihe ọ bụla dị na anụ gị, ị maara, n'ihi na n'ezie, ee, Valencia dị ka obodo dị mkpa n'ezie na mpaghara anyị. Anyị adịghịdị eche otú ahụ, ma mgbe ahụ nke ahụ bụ ihe na-awụ akpata oyi n'ahụ ịhụ. Ma mgbe ahụ ị ghọtara na nke a bụ eziokwu ọhụrụ anyị maka oge a, ị maara.

[00:46:46] Sangeeta Waldron: Kpamkpam. Na anyị bụ. Ọ bụrụ na ọ bụghị. Mana echere m na anyị ga-amalite ịhụ ọtụtụ ụdị nsogbu ndị a na usoro nri anyị n'ihi na ọnọdụ ihu igwe na-emetụta mpaghara ndị ọzọ na anyị nwere ike ọ gaghị eche na ọ ga-eme ugbu a, mana mgbe, mgbe anyị na-ele anya. Ị mara, n'ihu na a kara aka, anyị na-aga na-amalite ịhụ mmetụta nke na. M nọkwa na-agụ ebe, n'ihi idei mmiri na Valencia, oroma ga-adị ụkọ karị.

Ma anyị nwere ike ọ gaghị eche otú ahụ ugbu a, ma anyị ga-eme ya n'ime ọnwa isii ọzọ.

[00:47:29] Jackie De Burca: N'ezie. M pụtara, anyị nwere ndị agbata obi na, na ala, ị maara, ndị ọrụ ugbo. Ha bụ ndị ọrụ ugbo oroma. Na mkpokọta oroma na-aga n'ihu ugbu a. Mana otu n'ime ndị agbata obi anyị maara nke ọma, o kwuru n'ụzọ nkịtị izu ole na ole gara aga, ọ bụụrụ ha ọdachi zuru oke. Ee.

[00:47:46] Sangeeta Waldron: Ị mara na ihu igwe dị na Valencia, ọ nwere ike ọ gaghị adị na mpaghara mpaghara gị, mana ọ nwere mmetụta.

[00:47:53] Jackie De Burca: Ee, anyị nwere ihu igwe yiri nke ahụ ebe a, mana ọ bụghị oke egwu. Ya mere, anyị nwere izu, izu na izu dịka mmiri ozuzo anaghị akwụsị. Ya mere, lee, ọ emetụtala ma dị ka ị na-ekwu, nke a bụ ihe, ị maara, ọ dị mwute ikwu na oge a, anyị ga-enwe ike ịnagide eziokwu ahụ ruo mgbe, dị ka mụ na gị na-atụ anya na ọtụtụ ndị ọzọ na m na-ekwu. ka, ihe ngwọta ndị a niile dị ịtụnanya nke nwere ike ịbanye n'ime ebe ga-abanye ebe ahụ. Ya mere. Yabụ, anyị ga-edobe mkparịta ụka ahụ nke ọma. Ihe dị mkpa, echere m na mkparịta ụka a bụ ọrụ nke akwụkwọ gị yana mgbasa ozi ndị ọzọ. Dịka ọkachamara nkwukọrịta ozi, Sangeeta, kedu ka ọ dị gị maka ọrụ mgbasa ozi na-arụ n'ịkwalite mkparịta ụka ihu igwe?

[00:48:38] Sangeeta Waldron: Ọ na-arụ ọrụ dị mkpa na ọkachasị taa ebe ụdị ozi nke oge a ebe ihe niile dị ugbu a, anyị nwekwara ọtụtụ mgbanwe.

Ya mere ọ na-arụ ọrụ dị mkpa n'ezie. Ọrụ anyị bụ ịhụ na anyị na-enyocha ihe niile anyị na-agụ n'ezie, na ọ bụ isi mmalite n'ihi na enwere ọtụtụ ihe na-ezighi ezi dịka anyị maara. Ya mere, ihe anyị na-ahụ, ihe anyị na-ekiri, ihe anyị na-agụ dị oké mkpa na nke a na otú anyị si edebe onwe anyị ihe ọmụma dị mkpa. Na kwa ndị mmadụ nwere ike inwe mmetụta nke ịka njọ. Ha na-eche, oh, akụkọ dị otú ahụ, ị ​​maara, jọrọ njọ na egwu. Anyị achọghị ịma ọzọ. Ma olee otú, ọ bụrụ na ị kwụsịrị ikiri ma ọ bụ na-agụ akụkọ, kedu ka ị ga-esi mara otú ị ga-esi mee mgbanwe ma ọ bụ ihe na-eme ka ọ dị, ị maara, ọ bụ ụdị aghụghọ ugbu a n'ihi na akụkọ ahụ na-akụda mmụọ, ma anyị. kwesịrị ịkọrọ ya na anyị kwesịrị iji ezigbo isi mmalite mara.

[00:49:58] Jackie De Burca: Ee, nke ahụ dị ezigbo mkpa. Ugbu a, o doro anya na ị kwuru na akụkọ ahụ na-akụda mmụọ ma echere m, ị maara, ọ dịghị onye kwesịrị ịnụ ka ị na-ekwu ya n'ihi na ha maara ya n'onwe ha. Mana olee otu ị chere akwụkwọ ga-enye aka na mgbasa ozi na ozi n'ozuzu ya?

[00:50:13] Sangeeta Waldron: Ọfọn, enwere m otu isi na akwụkwọ gbasara mgbasa ozi na m na-agwa ụfọdụ ndị isi olu na-arụ ọrụ n'ime mgbasa ozi, gụnyere onye nta akụkọ gburugburu ebe obibi na Brazil na onye nta akụkọ mpaghara ebe a. London, na ọrụ mgbasa ozi na-arụ. Mana karịa ihe ọ bụla, akwụkwọ ahụ na-enye ndị mmadụ ụzọ, obere ndụmọdụ, aro na anyị niile nwere ike ime ka anyị nwee mmetụta na anyị na-eme mgbanwe, na anyị ekwesịghị ime, ịmara, anaghị m ekwu na anyị niile ga-abụ onye anaghị eri anụ. anyị agaghịkwa aga ezumike ma anyị na-anọdụ ala n'ụlọ.

Akwụkwọ abụghị nke ahụ. Akwukwo bu kedu ka i si ebi ndu?

Mee ihe ndị ị hụrụ n'anya, mana ị na-atụle mbara ala na obere ụzọ n'ihi na ọ bụ obere ụzọ na-emepụta mgbanwe. Otu n'ime ihe m kwenyere bụ mgbe anyị malitere ime obere mgbanwe ndị a, ha na-abawanye na tupu anyị amara ya, anyị zutere, anyị na-eme ihe ndị ka ukwuu na mma. Ma nke ahụ bụ ebe ọ dị anyị mkpa ka anyị niile nọrọ, na-eme nnukwu ihe, ka mma, ihe amamihe dị na ya maka ụwa.

[00:51:33] Jackie De Burca: Echere m na obere mgbanwe ahụ nwere ike inye ndị mmadụ ike, Sangeeta, ọ bụghị gị?

[00:51:37] Sangeeta Waldron: 100%. M pụtara, na ọ pụrụ nnọọ ịbụ ihe ndị dị otú ahụ dị ka ịkọrọ, ị maara, ịmara eziokwu pụtara na ị na-na na na ị na-eme a ibu na mma ihe.

Ịweta ahịhịa gị n'ụlọ kama ịtụba ya n'ala bụ ihe nwere nzube. Ịbụ akụkụ nke mbuli ihe mkpofu na-eme mgbanwe. Ihe ndị a niile, ị maara, ọ bụghị ịzụrụ plastik dị ukwuu, na-ebelata plastik gị, na-eche otú ị ga-esi belata plastik gị na-eme ka ọ dị iche.

Ihe ndị a niile na-agbakwụnye. Ibelata ihe mkpofu nri gị, ị mara, na-eme gị.

Naanị na-eme ka ị dịkwuo mma na mbara ala. Ịmara ihe dị na oge, ị maara, iri nri.

Ndị mmadụ echefuola ihe iri nri n'oge, ụdị akwụkwọ nri na mkpụrụ osisi a na-akụ n'oge ọ bụla ka i wee rie. Ebe ọ bụ na e mebiela anyị, anyị na-enwe strawberries n'afọ niile. Strawberries adịghị n'ime afọ niile, ị maara, yabụ na ọ maara ihe dị na oge. Ma mgbe ị na-eri nri n'oge, ị n'ezie. Na ọzọ n'akwụkwọ, m inyocha ntakịrị banyere nke a, ma ị na-akwalite gị onwe gị dịghịzi usoro.

Ị na-enwe ahụ ike karịa mgbe anyị na-eri nri n'oge.

Anyị na mbara ala dị mma. Ee.

[00:53:12] Jackie De Burca: A ga-enwekwa. Nke ahụ bara uru n'onwe ya. Ma mgbe ahụ, ị ​​maara, dị ka ụfọdụ ndị na-abanye na nri ma ọ bụ foodies ma ọ bụrụ na-amasị gị, ga-marakwa bụ ma ọ bụrụ na ọ ga-ekwe omume na nke ahụ bụ mpaghara sourced nakwa dị ka n'oge n'ihi na ume nke nri ahụ ga-abụ ihe na-adaba na ụda. mpaghara ị nọ na ya.

[00:53:30] Sangeeta Waldron: ezi? Ee, 100%, Jackie.

[00:53:33] Jackie De Burca: Yabụ na ọ bụ isiokwu na-adọrọ mmasị naanị.

Agbanyeghị, akwụkwọ gị, o doro anya na ebumnuche gị bụ ịhapụ ndị na-agụ mmụọ mmụọ ka ha mee ihe. Ọ bụrụ na enwere otu ozi, Sangeeta, nke ị nwere olile anya na ọ ga-adabara onye na-agụ akwụkwọ ọ bụla mgbe emechara ya, gịnị ka nke ahụ ga-abụ?

[00:53:48] Sangeeta Waldron: Bụrụ mgbanwe.

[00:53:51] Jackie De Burca: Zuru okè.

[00:53:52] Sangeeta Waldron: Zuru oke.

[00:53:53] Jackie De Burca: Ọ dị mma. Ya mere, olee mgbe akwụkwọ ahụ ga-adị na ebee ka ọ ga-adị maka ịzụta?

[00:54:00] Sangeeta Waldron: Ọ dị mma, ndị mmadụ nwere ike ịtụ akwụkwọ ugbu a.

[00:54:03] Jackie De Burca: Ọ mara mma.

[00:54:04] Sangeeta Waldron: Ee. Yabụ ị nwere ike ịga n'ịntanetị wee buru ụzọ tụọ akwụkwọ ebe ọ bụla ịnọ n'ụwa.

Ị nwere ike. Akwụkwọ a na-apụta n'ihu ọha na 30th nke Jenụarị wee dị ya nke ọma n'ụlọ ahịa akwụkwọ, ụlọ ahịa akwụkwọ anụ ahụ na ọzọ n'ịntanetị.

Mana ee, ọ bụ, ọ dị ugbu a maka ịtụ ụzọ na enwere m olileanya na ndị mmadụ ga-ebu ụzọ tụọ ya ma gụọ ya, ọ ga-amasị m n'ezie ịmara ihe ndị mmadụ na-eche.

[00:54:41] Jackie De Burca: Yabụ na 2025 ọ ga-adị mma, ị mara, nweta nzaghachi ahụ mgbe ị matara karịa maka ya, mgbe ị nwere ndị mmadụ na-enye gị nzaghachi. Ọ bụrụ na ị ga-enye ndị na-ege ntị otu ndụmọdụ na njedebe nke mkparịta ụka a, na-ahapụ ha n'echiche nke gị banyere ịmepụta ihe nketa dị mma maka mbara ala, gịnị ka nke ahụ ga-abụ?

[00:55:01] Sangeeta Waldron: Sangeeta, jiri onwe gị malite. Chefuo ihe ndị ọzọ na-eme ma ọ bụ na ha anaghị eme. Naanị malite na nke gị. Cheekwa echiche banyere otu ihe ị ga-achọ ime nke dịịrị gị mfe ma ọ laghachitela n'echiche ahụ. Bụrụ mgbanwe.

[00:55:18] Jackie De Burca: Fantastic. Ya mere kwụ ọtọ. Sangeeta, a na m achọ gị nke ọma na akwụkwọ a. Eji m n'aka na ọ ga-abịa ma nwee ihe ịga nke ọma ịbụ, ị mara, ka ndị mmadụ na-enwekwu obi ụtọ, ndị ga-agụ ya ma na-etinye aka na echiche niile na-adọrọ adọrọ nke doro anya n'ebe ahụ ma mụta ihe na ya ma bụrụ mgbanwe ahụ, dịka ị na-ekwu. onwe gi.

[00:55:38] Sangeeta Waldron: Daalụ Jackie nke ukwuu, maka inwe m na inwe mmasị na akwụkwọ ahụ. Nke ahụ pụtara ọtụtụ ihe ma daalụ. Naanị daalụ. Jupụta na ekele.

[00:55:48] Jackie De Burca: Daalụ. Sangeeta abụwo ọmarịcha ọmarịcha.

[00:55:52] Nke a bụ olu na-ewuli elu.

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