S4, E3: Liyini Ifa Lakho? Ukuhlola Uguquko Lomhlaba kanye no-Sangeeta Waldron

Okulotshiweyo Okukhiqizwe Ngedijithali

[00:00:09] UJackie De Burca: NginguJackie De Burca futhi namuhla nginesiqephu esijabulisa kakhulu no-Sangeeta Waldron, okhuluma nathi ngencwadi yakhe yesithathu, “Liyoba Yini Ifa Lakho? Izingxoxo nabaguquli begeyimu yomhlaba wonke”.

Futhi uSangeeta ukhulume nabashintshi abangama-36. Ukukhetha okuthakazelisa ngempela nokuhluke ngendlela emangalisayo kwabantu abavela emhlabeni wonke.

Amanye amagama angase ajwayelekile kwabanye benu. Kodwa omunye uzoba cishe ngokuqinisekile. Lona ngu-Julian Lennon, oyindodana ka-John Lennon, kodwa eyiciko kakhulu nesishoshovu ngaphakathi kwelungelo lakhe.

Ngiyawuncoma kakhulu umsebenzi kaSangeeta.

Ube yingxenye yokwakhiwa kwegama elithi Constructive Voices, esilibonga kakhulu.

Sangeeta, kuyajabulisa ukuba nengxoxo nawe namuhla.

[00:01:01] USangeeta Waldron: Oh, nami, Jackie. Futhi ngiyabonga ngesingeniso esihle kangaka futhi kuhle ukuphindela engxoxweni nawe.

[00:01:08] Jackie De Burca: Thank you so much, Sangeeta. So would you like to elaborate a little bit more on your career, you know, where you are to date, first of all, about your PR work and of course, then about your books.

[00:01:19] Sangeeta Waldron: Impela.

Not to sound or put anyone to sleep, but I’ve been over 30 years in communications and public relations work. I started out my career many, many moons ago writing speeches and briefings for a previous Prime Minister, UK Prime Minister and Ministers. I’ve worked for some of the most amazing brands, global brands. I worked for the first Mayor of London, Ken Livingstone. And in 2009, I set up my own PR agency, Serendipity. PR and Media. Serendipity is something I strongly believe in. And in 2009, when I set up the agency, the world was going through a global recession. And I thought, if I can survive this, then I can survive anything. And fast forward 2024. I’m still here and I’m thriving. And during that time, since 2009, I’ve written three books. My first book was on PR public relations and it’s called the PR Knowledge Book. And that’s a book that went to universities around the world and it’s still doing well. And it. Oh, God, you know, I can’t even remember timelines now. But in 20, well, during the pandemic or. Well, yes, during the pandemic, I published my second book, which is Corporate Social Responsibility is Not Public Relations.

And that’s a book all about greenwashing.

And that book was so timely. And relevant, and is still relevant into day’s conversations about what companies are doing and how companies are behaving. And that book was shortlisted for the Business book awards in 2022 and now in 2025, I will be publishing my third book on the 30th of January. And that book is a continuation of the conversation I had in my second book. And this one is looking at the climate crisis. And the book is called what will your legacy be? Global conversations with change makers. And I’ve interviewed 36 thought leaders, business leaders, community leaders from around the world. I have Julian Lennon in the book, I have a NASA scientist, a researcher who’s looking into humpback whales. So the book has got different themes and importantly, there’s a takeaway for the reader at the end of every chapter to hopefully create a more of a pro planet habit and mindset. So that’s me in a nutshell, Jackie.

[00:04:30] UJackie De Burca: Ngakho-ke, Sangeeta, ngicabanga ukuthi kwakuyisethulo esihle leso futhi ngisijabulele kakhulu. Inikeza umbono omuhle womhlaba wonke ngomsebenzi wakho nezincwadi. Futhi masivele singene siqonde ngqo encwadini yakho entsha futhi sicela usitshele, liyoba yini ifa lakho? Izingxoxo nabashintshi begeyimu emhlabeni jikelele mayelana nenkinga yesimo sezulu. Yini ekugqugquzele ukuthi uyibhale kwasekuqaleni, Sangeeta?

[00:04:55] USangeeta Waldron: Umbuzo omuhle ngempela lowo, Jackie. Futhi kufanele ngibuyele emuva esikhathini esingangonyaka nesigamu esedlule futhi umshicileli wami uMartin wathi kimi, Sangeeta, asihambe siyodla isidlo sasemini. Wathi kimi, Ngicabanga ukuthi usukulungele ukubhala incwadi yakho yesithathu. Futhi ngathi, uyazi, Martin? Ngicabanga ukuthi ngiqinisile? Ngicabanga ukuthi ngimi ngomumo ngoba bengicabanga ngemibono ethile futhi bengilokhu ngicabanga ngenkinga yesimo sezulu nokuthi kwenzakalani nokuthi singawenza kanjani umehluko sonke. Waqala lapho-ke umqondo. Futhi ngangifuna ngempela. Bengifuna ukubhala incwadi lapho sonke singasusa okuthile kuyo. Ngakho-ke akugcini nje ukukhuluma ngenkinga yesimo sezulu, kodwa yini sonke esingayenza, noma ngabe ilula kangakanani, noma incane kangakanani, ukuthi singenza umehluko. Ngoba ngiyakholwa ukuthi sonke singenza umehluko. Futhi ngizosho enye into futhi. Abantu bahlale bethi, ini? Ngenzeni? Umuntu oyedwa angenzani? Umuntu onjengami angawenza muphi umehluko? Futhi ngihlala ngisho lokhu, ukuthi, niyazi, isenzo esisodwa singadala ukugeleza futhi lawo mazansi ahlangane futhi ndawonye singakha i-tsunami. Futhi leyo tsunami ingaba nomthelela omuhle futhi ibe yi-pro planet. Ngakho lokho kwakuwukucabanga kwangempela kwencwadi.

[00:06:20] UJackie De Burca: Ngicabanga ukuthi, ngokwami, kuyamangaza ukuthi kuphume kuleyo ngxoxo. Kodwa ngokusobala umshicileli wakho ukwazi kahle kakhulu futhi ubekulungele, uyazi, ukuthi isikhathi besilungile. Futhi lokhu bekuvele kube yinto ekhulayo, uyazi, enhliziyweni yakho nasemphefumulweni wakho nasengqondweni yakho njalonjalo. Wonke umqondo wefa, i-Sangeeta, iwumgogodla wencwadi, ngokusobala. Uthini umbono wakho ngefa? Kusho ukuthini kuwe? Uzichaza kanjani umqondo ngokwakho?

[00:06:49] USangeeta Waldron: O, umbuzo omuhle ngempela lowo, Jackie. Futhi ngifuna ukusho okuthize. Usho okuthize ngenkathi wethula lo mbuzo, futhi uqinisile impela.

Konke kwakumayelana nomuzwa, lokhu. Lokhu kuxhumana komphefumulo. Benginalokhu kucabanga, futhi ngikholelwa ukuthi incwadi yami ngayinye inamandla ayo kanye nesikhathi sayo. Ngakho bengifuna ukukusho lokho.

Futhi ifa, kimi izwi elikhulu kakhulu. Futhi lapho ngixoxa nabantu encwadini, abanye abantu bazizwa begajwe kakhulu yigama ngokwalo.

Kodwa kimina, ngicabanga ukuthi kuvele kushiye iplanethi ingcono kancane kunalokho engikutholile. Futhi hhayi nje ukuyishiya ingcono, niyazi, iminyaka emihlanu, eyishumi ezayo, kodwa ngenxa. Eminyakeni eyikhulu ezayo, iminyaka engu-200 ezayo, ngoba kufanele sicabange ngaleyo ndlela.

Futhi isibonelo esihle salokhu ukuthi, uyazi, uma uya kuqala, lapho abanye abantu beya ku-Primark noma lapho abanye abantu beya kwezinye zalezi zitolo zemfashini ezisheshayo futhi bazothenga phezulu bese becabanga, kulungile. , asisayifuni leyo top, futhi bazoyifaka endaweni yokulahla imfucuza.

Ngezinye izikhathi. Ngokungaguquguquki, lezo ziqongo zingathatha iminyaka eyi-100 ukuwohloka ngoba zishibhile futhi zenziwe ngemicu yepulasitiki. Futhi ngakho ucabanga ukuthi kunjalo. Lokho kuzoba yifa lakho eminyakeni eyikhulu ezayo? Angifuni ifa lami libe yilokho. Ngifuna kube yinto ephusile.

I want it to make a difference to somebody in the future with the air they’re breathing, with the. And I hope that they’ll still be able to tap into nature that we have now. So, yes, it’s something deep for me.

[00:08:52] UJackie De Burca: Yebo, ngicabanga ukuthi lokho kucace kakhulu. Kusukela emsebenzini wakho kuze kube manje futhi ngokusobala incwadi entsha esikhuluma ngayo namuhla, uzizwe kanjani ukuthi yamukelwe nababambe iqhaza oxoxisane nabo? Ingabe bekukukhulu kakhulu kwabanye babo ekuqaleni? Ingabe kwakungokuthile okwakunamandla kubo, noma abanye babo babelungile ngakho, wonke umqondo wefa?

[00:09:14] USangeeta Waldron: Yebo, kuyathakazelisa ngempela ngoba ngibuza wonke umuntu umbuzo ofanayo, othi, yini, izoba yini, ufuna ifa lakho libe yini? Ngababuza lokho ekupheleni kwayo yonke Ingxoxo.

Futhi abanye abantu, amanye amazwi ayethi, o, angazi, lowo ngumbuzo omkhulu ngempela, futhi babenjalo nje. Azizwe egajwe yikho. Abanye abantu babengekho ngoba benomuzwa wokuthi vele basendleleni yokwenza ifa futhi bafuna ukuqhubeka nomsebenzi wabo.

Kodwa obekuthakazelisa cishe kuwo wonke umuntu, ngisho nalabo abathi, oh, umbuzo omkhulu kangaka, noma labo abathe, niyazi, sifuna ukuqhubeka. Sibona kanjena, wonke umuntu ubengazitsheli noma uyazi, ezizwa emncane ngegalelo lakhe, engithole ukuthi kukhulu ukuzithoba ezimpendulweni zabo. Futhi ngithole lokho impela, angazi, ngokuxakile, kunikeza amandla kakhulu. Uyazi, kwakungekho ego kulokhu. Kwakumayelana nokwenza kangcono nokwenza kahle.

[00:10:29] UJackie De Burca: Yeka impendulo enhle. Ngakho-ke, ngandlela thile, kuza kimi ukuthi, yiqiniso, abantu abazizwa, o, kahle, angiyena uJulian Lennon noma, niyazi, ngeke ngibasho bonke abanye abantu, kodwa angiyena umuntu. kanjalo. Pho yiliphi ithuba enginalo uma abantu abanjalo bezwa ukuthi yigama elikhulu kangaka. Kodwa eqinisweni, okushilo lapho, Sangeeta, kunjalo. Iyasuka ku-ego futhi izama nje ukudlala indima yakho, noma imuphi usayizi onjalo, uma umncane ngempela. Kodwa kuyingxenye yesithombe esiphelele, akunjalo?

[00:10:57] USangeeta Waldron: Impela, yebo. Futhi lowo kwaba umuzwa. Ngazizwa ngiyingxenye yento ethile, uyazi, ngokusebenzisa kwabo. Ukuthobeka kwabo. Ngazizwa ngiyingxenye yalokho. Ngangiyingxenye yento enkulu kunami.

Kwakunjalo. Kwakuwumuzwa onika amandla. Futhi ngemva kwayo yonke ingxoxo ngangizizwa nginethemba futhi wonke umuntu wayenethemba futhi lokho kanye nenkolelo yokuthi mhlawumbe ngeke sikwazi ukushintsha izinto, kodwa singathola izixazululo ezinkingeni zethu.

[00:11:32] UJackie De Burca: Nakanjani. Ngicabanga ukuthi kunezixazululo eziningi ezinhle kakhulu ezilungiswayo ezindaweni ezahlukahlukene njengamanje, kanye namandla amaningi kanye namathuba. Manje, kusobala ukuthi usebenze ngamazwi akhayo ku-RPR ezinsukwini zethu zakuqala, ngakho usazi kangcono kunabanye abaningi okwaxoxwa nabo. Sangeeta, uma usebenzisa umqondo wefa kubantu abasebenza endaweni eyakhiwe, ungayenza kanjani? Noma ubungayishintsha nhlobo?

[00:11:59] USangeeta Waldron: Ngicabanga ukuthi kuhlala kunendawo yokuthuthukisa. Lokho kuya kunoma yimuphi umkhakha futhi singahlala sizithuthukisa thina. Kodwa ngicabanga ngempela wonke umuntu on a. Ukusebenza ekwakhiweni, kusuka phezulu kuya phansi, abantu abenza zonke izinto zokuphatha, lokho futhi kubaluleke kakhulu ekwakheni ukuze wonke umuntu acabange nje, singayenza kanjani kangcono iplanethi? Uyazi, singasebenzisa okuningi izinto ezisimeme? Singacabanga yini nge-supply chain? Singacabanga ukuthi sakha kuphi nokuthi sakha kanjani kule ndawo yasendaweni. Futhi eqinisweni, encwadini, ngikhuluma nomuntu osebenza emkhakheni wezokwakha futhi ukhuluma ngazo zonke izinto ezimangalisayo ezenzekayo okungenzeka thina njengabantu abavamile esingazazi ngokwanele noma esingazithandi, njengoSangeeta.

[00:12:59] UJackie De Burca: Ngakho-ke ngiyamangala ukuthi ngingene kulokho ngenxa yababukeli bethu.

[00:13:03] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah. So things such as there is now, there’s an app, I believe, where people can actually, when they’re building something, a site they can actually track to see what’s the carbon footprint of that piece of wood or those bricks or whatever that their. That those materials are coming from. There’s a lot of thought now being put into the architecture of a building, whether it’s a school, a shopping complex, a housing site. There’s a lot of thought going into that. And also from the builders, the people working on the site, there’s a lot of thought going into how they’re approaching that build. So I think that’s really interesting because we. I didn’t really appreciate that enough. And whether it’s a big venue for music or a sports stadium, those izakhiwo zakhiwa ngenhloso nenjongo ngomphakathi nemvelo.

[00:14:09] Jackie De Burca: Yes, there’s certainly an awful lot of positive changes. Again, lots of different apps and all sorts of initiatives and some of the leading companies are really working with nature mind now. So there is a huge amount of change going on at the moment. I don’t know if you remember or not from one of the panels that you sat on for Constructive Voices in the relatively early days, a gentleman called Neil Maxwell. And I’d like to mention him purely because he is a lovely example of somebody who had a very, very successful company in the built environment doing fit outs, a chap based in Liverpool. And he was making lots and lots of money until he went on a voyage to the Arctic. And then he came back a changed man and he set up Changing Streams. I don’t know if you remember him at all.

[00:15:01] USangeeta Waldron: Yebo, ngiyakwenza.

[00:15:02] U-Jackie De Burca: Ngakho-ke uyisibonelo esihle somuntu ofana naye, othathele phezulu ukuthi kwenzakalani. Futhi yena, niyazi, wayenza imali eningi ngenkampani yakhe. Ngicabanga ukuthi ugcine eyidayisile inkampani yakhe wabe esesungula iChanging Streams. Futhi lapho ekuqaleni kwalo nyaka, baphinde bethula Izinto Ezishintshayo, okuyigama, okuzokunikeza umqondo wokuthi, yebo, bafuna ukwakha. Bakha insiza yabantu abangaphakathi kwendawo eyakhelweyo ukuze bathole izinto ezingcono zemvelo yethu kanye nemvelo. Ngakho-ke ziningi izinto ezenzekayo, Sangeeta, okuyinto enhle ngempela. Ngokusobala bonke abantu okhulume nabo encwadini, beninamazwi angu-36 ahlukene. Kwakungabantu abahlukahlukene kakhulu, ngokusobala abahlaba umxhwele, kunjalo. Uhambe kanjani ngokukhetha labo bantu futhi hlobo luni lwetimu obunethemba lokuzihlola ngezindaba zabo?

[00:15:55] USangeeta Waldron: Hhayi-ke, ngangicace kakhulu ezindikimbeni zencwadi. Ngakho-ke bengifuna ukumboza izingqikithi ezibanzi ezivela kwisayensi ngoba yilapho yonke into iqala khona kule ngxoxo yesimo sezulu.

Ubuholi, ubuholi bomhlaba wonke, ibhizinisi, umhlaba webhizinisi, ukudla, ngoba sonke sihlobene nalokho. Kuphakathi kokuthi sithenga noma, uyazi, sibeka ukudla etafuleni noma sinjalo, abanye bethu bangabalimi, abakhiqizi. Ngakho ngangifuna ukuhlola ukudla.

Imidiya idlala indima enkulu kanye nemiphakathi, kunjalo, bese kuba umculo nobuciko ngoba lokho kuyingxenye yokuxoxwa kwezindaba ngaphakathi kwengxoxo yesimo sezulu. Ngakho-ke nginalezi zindikimba futhi nginesahluko esikhethekile nge-India ngoba manje isinabantu abaningi emhlabeni futhi njengesifunda, yazi kangcono kunanoma ubani ngezinselelo zenkinga yesimo sezulu. Ngakho-ke nganginalezi zindikimba futhi ngangifuna nokuqinisekisa ukuthi le ncwadi igcwele ukuhlukahluka futhi inokufakwa. Ngakho ukuhlukahluka nokufakwa kwezwi. Ngakho-ke bengifuna ukwenza isiqiniseko sokuthi sinawo, noma nginamazwi abesifazane abaningi encwadini kanye nabantu bemiphakathi nezizinda ezahlukene. Futhi lapho ngingamtholi umuntu wesifazane, ngangizokwenza isiqiniseko sokuthi umuntu othile ovela emphakathini noma emphakathini wohlanga onikeza lokho kuhlukahluka kwezwi. Ngoba enye yezinto ezibalulekile, ikakhulukazi emazweni asathuthuka, ahlaselwa, kahle, sebehlaselwe yinkinga yesimo sezulu isikhathi eside kakhulu. Uyazi, ukubuyela emuva kuma-80s, 90s, bathintekile. Manje lapha entshonalanga, sikhungethwe yinkinga yesimo sezulu. Kodwa babebekezelele okwakwenzeka isikhathi eside. Futhi ucwaningo olukhombisayo ukuthi abesifazane bangabokuqala ukuthintwa yinoma yiluphi uhlobo lwenhlekelele yesimo sezulu. Ngoba njalo abantu besifazane basekhaya.

Ngakho-ke uma kuyi-tsunami noma isomiso, yibona abathinteka kakhulu. Ngakho ngangifuna ngempela ukunikeza lowo mbono encwadini.

[00:18:21] UJackie De Burca: Ngakho-ke kuzwakala sengathi usebenze kanzima ngendlela emangalisayo ukuze nje uzuze ukuhlukahluka kwamazwi ezingxoxweni zakho ezingama-36.

[00:18:30] Sangeeta Waldron: Yebo.

[00:18:31] UJackie De Burca: Futhi-ke bekufanele ubhale incwadi ngemuva kwalokho, kusobala.

[00:18:34] Sangeeta Waldron: Yebo. Futhi futhi, niyazi, ukubuka nje kwisayensi, thina, niyazi, isayensi ibuswa kakhulu ngamadoda. Ngakho ngangifuna ngempela ukuthola abesifazane, ngithole ososayensi. Futhi ngathola izingqondo ezimbili ezimangalisayo, ezihlakaniphile.

One is a NASA scientist and she’s Dr. Kimberly Minor and she works in the Arctic region as well. And the other is Roberta Boscolo, who. Yes, so.

Yebo. Ngakho Ngijabule ngempela. Ngithole cishe kuzo zonke izahluko owesifazane ozonikeza umbono.

[00:19:16] UJackie De Burca: Kuhle lokho. Manje, ngiyazi ukuthi lokhu ayihloselwe ukufana ne-documentary enamahora ambalwa ubude, okungenzeka ukuthi iyifanele, uyazi, ukuya kulelo zinga lemininingwane mhlawumbe ngokuhamba kwesikhathi lapho incwadi ikhishwa ngempela.

Ngakho-ke kuzoba nzima kuwe ukuthi uphendule lo mbuzo ngendlela, Sangeeta, kodwa ungathanda ukukhetha eminye yemininingwane emangalisa kakhulu noma ekhuthazayo oyifunde ezingxoxweni zakho?

[00:19:40] USangeeta Waldron: Ngiyazi imibuzo enobuqili njengokukhetha ingane yami engcono kakhulu. Uyazi, iyiphi ingane engiyithanda kakhulu?

Mina, uyazi, engikutholile futhi okuhlale kimi umlingo we-humpback whale.

And I spoke to this researcher, her name’s Rachel. And just, I mean, I’ll say this because I want people to buy the book and read what she says. But what is extraordinary and what I’ve. I’ve learned during this process of writing the book is that nature has provided everything for us. She has thought of everything. Everything in our ecosystem has a function and has a place, and it works to keep things in balance, from the Arctic to the Antarctic, to marine creatures living in our ocean and our seas, to what, the trees on the land. And unfortunately, it’s been us humans who’ve gone in and disrupted the balance. But even a species like the humpback whale plays a very important part in our survival.

Futhi ngizokushiya kuleyo cliffhanger.

[00:21:03] Jackie De Burca: Definitely going to be reading the book. I would have done anyhow, in my case, because, you know, obviously I have a huge respect for your work, but, yes, that is a cliffhanger. Quite fascinating, obviously. The book includes interviews with personalities, as you’ve mentioned, ranging from the likes of, you know, Roberta Boscolo, who we both know, to musicians. And that means that there is such a broad range of perspectives going to be obviously there in the book. How do you feel that enriches the dialogue around climate change, Sangeeta?

[00:21:32] Sangeeta Waldron: Well, you know, as humans, we love stories. Stories is part of our DNA, and music and art are part of that. They’re that ingredient. And I speak to an art activist in the book, and she does these incredible drawings and paintings that really connects you to what’s happening in the seas and in the ocean. And I’ll just say this very quickly. I also speak to a songwriter. He’s called Stevie Kalinich, and he’s 80 years young, and Stevie used to write for the Beach Boys, songwriter for the Beach Boys. And he talks about one of his songs called Little Bird. And Again, it just shows you how music connects us with nature and the spirit of nature. And now the UN is also got lots of initiatives using musicians and artists to help us feel more connected to our surroundings.

[00:22:38] UJackie De Burca: Kuyamangaza lokho. Ngakho-ke ngicabanga ukuthi lokho kusiholela kahle kakhulu. Ngiyazi ukuthi awukwazi ukukhetha izingane eziyintandokazi kwabangu-36, kodwa ake sikhulume ngobuciko nomculo nalokho okwaziyo ukuthi kuhlobene kakhulu nabantu abaningi. Ngisho noma bengathandi ubuciko noma umculo, abantu abaningi bajabulela uhlobo oluthile lobuciko noma umculo. Ngakho-ke hlobo luni lokuthatha esinalo ebhukwini kusuka kulezo zindawo ezithile?

[00:23:05] USangeeta Waldron: Hhayi-ke, uyazi, empeleni umculo ubuyela emuva. Ngithi emuva, ngingazami ukuthandana nathi. UJackie lapha.

[00:23:13] UJackie De Burca: Qaphela, Sangeeta.

[00:23:16] USangeeta Waldron: Uya kuma-50s kanye nama-60s, kunomculo lapho owawukhuluma ngokushintsha kwesimo sezulu ngaleso sikhathi, uzama ukusixhumanisa, ukuthi sixhumeke nemvelo futhi sicabange ngeplanethi yethu. Ngakho-ke kunezingoma eziningi ezidumile, umculo odumile, futhi empeleni nginohlu lwalezo zingoma encwadini. Futhi, uyazi, noma ngabe ukhona. Uma ungabuthandi ubuciko futhi ungathandi ukuya kumagalari, kodwa ngiyaqiniseka ukuthi uzobe ufunda okuthile noma uzobona isithombe sento ethile, futhi lezo zithombe zenza imizwa ngaphakathi kwethu. Futhi uma. Cabanga nje ukube ubungeke usakwazi ukuphuma uzwe ukuhwashaza kwamaqabunga esihlahla noma imisindo yamagagasi, okubuye kube umculo. Umculo wemvelo.

Futhi awukwazanga ukuphuma uye epaki yangakini uyokhahlela ibhola noma uhambe nje epaki ngoba ibingasekho. Yini esizobe siyidweba ngokuzayo? Bekungaba yini ubuciko bethu? Yini esizoyiveza kulawo makhempasi? Futhi ukube besingasenawo umculo, ngabe silalelani kuSpotify noma emsakazweni? Kungavele kuthuleke. Ngakho-ke ngicabanga ukuthi kunokuhlobana okuningi nomculo, ubuciko, esikubukayo, esikufunda nemvelo. Imvelo iyasikhuthaza.

Futhi lokho kungenye yezinto ezibalulekile engizifunda kulaba baculi futhi laba babhali nababhali bezingoma ukuthi imvelo ibakhuthaza kangakanani.

Futhi ngalokho, ngethemba ukuthi ngizogqugquzelwa ukwenza umehluko emvelweni uqobo.

[00:25:07] UJackie De Burca: Impela uSangeet. Futhi ngicabanga ukuthi okufikayo emqondweni wami wukumboza abantu abanomuzwa wokuthi anginalo ikhono. O, angikutholi ngempela ubuciko noma angizifundi ngisho izincwadi nanoma yini. Kodwa abantu abaningi bazobheka. Futhi ngeke sikhulume ngolunye uhlobo lomkhiqizo omkhulu lapha. Kodwa abantu bazobuka okungenani amamuvi nochungechunge kumabonakude wabo futhi bakhonze futhi balandele noma yini abayithanda ngempela. Ngakho-ke ngandlela thize, ngicabanga ukuthi uma uqala ukukhipha izithako, njengokuthi sizithatha kalula, izigcawu esizibona efilimini esiyithandayo noma ochungechungeni lwe-TV esiyilandelayo, njengamaphesenti angu-X alezo zivela emvelweni. Futhi uma imvelo ingasekho, ifilimu esiyithandayo ibingeke yenziwe kwasekuqaleni.

[00:25:51] Sangeeta Waldron: 100.

Yebo. Besiyobe sibhekani? Isikrini esingenalutho? Noma ngabe sicabanga ukuthi, o, Nkulunkulu wami, kwakunjalo futhi manje yilokhu okuyikho.

Yeah. So we want to save those green spaces. We want to, you know, look after our parks. We want to take our rubbish home. We want to make sure we’re not filling our ocean and our seas with plastic. So otherwise it will be a very different kind of painting. But we’re actually seeing some of that being now written into our music and drawn into our art. How these things are changing the landscape.

[00:26:36] UJackie De Burca: Yebo. Okubaluleke kakhulu futhi, ngicabanga, ngaphandle kokuyifunda le ncwadi kuze kube manje, Sangeeta, enye yezinto efika engqondweni yakho isipho sakho sokuxhumana, indlela ohlanganisa ngayo incwadi. Ngokusobala, ubakhuthaza kakhulu abafundi bakho ukuthi baqaphele ukushintsha kwesimo sezulu. Awuzami ukubhola, uyazi, kuze kube sesifundo. Kwenziwa ngokuxoxwa kwezindaba. Ngokuxoxa indaba enamazwi angama-36 ahlukene kuwe, ukuhlanganisa konke futhi ukhulume ngakho. Yiziphi izinyathelo ezisebenzayo onomuzwa wokuthi abantu abafunda incwadi yakho bangazithatha kamuva ukuze babambe iqhaza ekusimameni?

[00:27:17] USangeeta Waldron: Ziningi izinto ezilula, ezilula okumele sizenze. Ngisho ukuthi kunezinto okungadingeki ukuthi uzenze, njengokuthi, uzenze. Ingabe uyazi? Kungenye yezinto ezibaluleke kakhulu esingayenza, okuyilokho esikwenzayo manje, phakathi kwethu, mina nawe sikhuluma ngakho. Ukukhuluma ngenkinga yesimo sezulu nokukhuluma ngayo nabanye. Khuluma ngayo nozakwenu emsebenzini, khuluma ngayo nofunda nabo, abangani bakho, ngoba lokho kukhulisa ukuqwashisa. Futhi ngokuqwashisa kuza noshintsho.

Ezinye izinto ezincane ongazenza lapho uxubha amazinyo, ungavumeli umpompi ugijime, wonga amanzi, ngoba amanzi manje aba yigugu. Nokho, liyigugu. Futhi kunezibalo ezishoyo ukuthi kancane kancane siphelelwa amanzi. Ngakho-ke izinto ezincane ezinjengalezo ukubeka isivalo sakho epanini lakho kuzokonga amanzi.

Yini enye engingakutshela yona? Ngisho nokuhamba nje epaki kukuxhumanisa nemvelo futhi kukusize uzizwe ugqugquzelekile ukwenza umehluko. Ukuyisa udoti wakho Ekhaya. Ungayishiyi epaki. Cabanga ngokungasebenzisi ibhodlela lepulasitiki, kodwa thatha. Thatha ibhodlela lakho lamanzi eligcwalisekayo. Zonke lezi zinto ezincane ziyahlangana futhi zenze umehluko.

[00:28:41] UJackie De Burca: Nakanjani bayakwenza. Manje, Sangeeta, uma ubuyela ezifundweni zakho ezingama-36 noma okukhulunywe nabo encwadini, uzwa sengathi abafundi bakho bazomangala futhi bakhuthazeke noma bashaqeke? Hlobo luni lwemizwa onethemba lokuyithola kubafundi esikhathini esizayo sencwadi yakho entsha?

[00:29:05] USangeeta Waldron: Zonke lezo zinto. Ephefumulelwe, ethukile. Hewu Nkosi yami. Bengingakwazi lokho. Ngisho ukuthi ngiphinde ngikhulume nalo mphathi-jikelele osewathatha umhlalaphansi ukuze akhulume ngokuthi ubuholi buyingxenye yengxoxo yesimo sezulu nokuthi amaqhinga ezempi ashintshwa kanjani ngenxa yokushintsha kwesimo sezulu. Ngisho, kuningi kakhulu encwadini. Kukhona nokudla.

Uma siya kulesi suphamakethe sendawo, singase sicabange, oh, umango ulapha. Kodwa bangaki bethu abakuqondayo ngempela ukuthi uma umango usesikhathini sonyaka kanye nalowomango osikwe kahle futhi ukuleyo nto encane enhle yokupakishwa kwepulasitiki, ukuthi iyini leyo ndawo yekhabhoni. Ngakho, yebo, ngakho nginjalo nje. Yebo, kuningi okumelwe ukwenze. Ngokuqinisekile.

[00:29:57] UJackie De Burca: Manje, ukhulume ngomholi wezempi wangaphambili okhona kusethi yemibuzo yami, ngoba bengicabanga ukuthi lokho kuyajabulisa futhi ngingathanda ngempela ukukuhlolisisa lokho nawe. Ungakwazi ukuchaza kancane kuleyo ngxoxo? Ngoba ngicabanga ukuthi lokho kuhlobana kakhulu nabantu. Yebo.

[00:30:16] USangeeta Waldron: Ngakho-ke ngenkathi ngibhala incwadi, ngisho ukuthi, sasinayo. Nokho, sisaqhubeka futhi manje sesinayo, uyazi, ingxabano yase-Ukraine neRussia, futhi manje sinakho okwenzeka eMpumalanga Ephakathi. Futhi kubonakala sengathi asiqondi ukuthi kuphinde kube nomthelela ngempi esimweni sezulu.

Ngakho lapho ngibhala incwadi, ngacabanga, Nkulunkulu, niyazi, ngidinga ukufaka okuthile ngalokho okwenzeka emhlabeni njengamanje. Futhi yona. Ngeke ngingene emininingwaneni, kodwa bekunokuningi ukuzola okuholele ekutheni ngikhulume nalokhu.

[00:30:53] UJackie De Burca: Kungani ngingamangazi? Sangeeta.

[00:30:58] Sangeeta Waldron: He. Futhi kwakunjalo ngempela. Futhi ngenkathi ngixoxa naye ngalo lolo suku, i-Guardian yayinalesi sihloko mayelana namaqhinga ezempi aguqulwa ukushintsha kwesimo sezulu, inkinga yesimo sezulu. Bekuyoba njalo. Kwakubonakala kusesikhathini ngempela, kufanelekile ngempela. Futhi angifuni ukuba ne-spo. Angifuni ukunikeza ama-spoilers, kodwa akhona. Indlela amasosha azisondeza ngayo ukuze abe yisixazululo esimweni sezulu. Isimo sezulu siyamangaza ngoba esingakuthandisisi ukuthi amathangi asebenzisa uphethiloli. Zonke lezi zingalo zine-carbon footprint. Ngakho-ke amasosha aphinde acabange amaqhinga ahlukene okunciphisa i-carbon footprint yawo, ebengicabanga ukuthi ihlaba umxhwele ngoba asazi ngempela, uyazi, ukuba ngaphandle nje, asikujabuleli lokho. Futhi nokuthi i-Ukraine, kahle, ingxabano yaseRussia yalokho okwenzekayo, ukuthi lokho kushintsha kanjani amaqhinga nokuthi kwenzekani ezingxenyeni ezithile zomhlaba.

Futhi nobuholi, uyazi, ngakho-ke ukuthi ubuholi bubaluleke kangakanani kulokhu, hhayi nje ubuhlakani bezempi, kodwa nakwezepolitiki.

And all these things are connected and we don’t seem to think that they are, that they are, but they are. Certainly they’re all, there’s lots of dots being joined in this. And yeah, I also discovered that the military want to be seen, not just to be seen, to be doing right by the planet, but they really want to, they’re authentically thinking about it and making these changes and they have these green WhatsApp conversations going on.

[00:32:50] UJackie De Burca: Kulungile, lokho kuhle.

Lokho empeleni, yebo, yebo, lokho ngempela, ngempela, kumnandi ngempela ukuzwa. Ngicabanga ukuthi ezingeni eliyisisekelo, uma ukhetha ukulwela izwe lakini, kungani-ke ungalwela uMama Womhlaba? Ngicabanga kanjalo. Yebo.

[00:33:07] U-Sangeeta Waldron: Futhi, ngokuthakazelisayo, nginalowo mbuzo, kodwa ngiwuhlaka ngokwehlukile encwadini. Uyazi uma ulwela izwe kusho ukuthini lokho? Ngoba uma ubheka e-UK, inkosi i-pro planet kakhulu. Yebo. Uyazi, uzinikele, impilo yakhe ibe yi-pro planethi. Futhi ungaba nohulumeni ongabonakali kakhulu iplanethi. Pho unjani wena njengomuntu wezempi? Ingabe uphikisana? Kusebenza kanjani lokho? Niyazi, uhulumeni wakho wangaleso sikhathi ungahle ungabi yiproplanet, kodwa owakho, owakho, inkosi yakho.

Ngakho. Yebo, ngakho ngihlola okunye kwalokho kucabanga encwadini.

[00:33:54] Jackie De Burca: No, but it does sound fascinating. Just going back to your point about fuel in the military. I literally thought yesterday we have a lot more small planes flying around where I am in Spain to check that we haven’t got fires because now is the burning season. This is the time of the year where farmers are allowed to burn whatever, you know, that they need, they feel they need to burn.

[00:34:16] Sangeeta Waldron: Yebo.

[00:34:17] UJackie De Burca: Futhi nganginomqondo ofanayo. Bengithi, lokho kuhle kakhulu ukuthi bakhona, ukuthi bayahlola ukuthi ngeke sihambe, niyazi, sivutha. Kodwa izindleko zikaphethiloli walezo zimoto ezenza lokho zinkulu nakwezemvelo.

[00:34:32] USangeeta Waldron: Futhi mina, ngisho ukuthi, asinazo zonke izixazululo okwamanje, uyazi, ngakho-ke senza okungcono kakhulu kwalokho esinakho.

Ngakho-ke mhlawumbe esikhathini esizayo, angazi, mhlawumbe kungaba ama-drones noma ezinye izindlela.

Kungaba amasathelayithi ukuhlola. Ngisho ukuthi, ngiyazi, ubuchwepheshe buyashintsha ngaso sonke isikhathi, kodwa akufanele sithembele kuphela kuzixazululo ezivela kubuchwepheshe. Kufanele futhi kube yilokho esikwenzayo sonke njengabantu ngabanye. Futhi ngicabanga ukuthi lokho bekungenye yezinto ukuthi ukubuyela engxoxweni yezempi, uyazi, siyakhohlwa ukuthi abasebenzi bamasosha bangabantu futhi nabo, banemindeni futhi bacabanga ngekusasa nokuthi yiliphi ifa abalitholayo. 'uyahamba.

Ngakho-ke yonke into ixhunyiwe, akukho okuhlukile?

[00:35:31] UJackie De Burca: Cha. Manje, ngicabanga ukuthi nginikeze uhlu lwamagama futhi asifuni ukuba nezingane esizithandayo, kodwa ngicabanga ukuthi igama abantu abaningi abajwayelekile abazokwazi kangcono ukuthi kuzoba nguJulian. U-Lennon, umbhali wengoma ngokwakhe futhi, indodana kaJohn Lennon. Singakwazi okungenani ukuba nengxoxo encane mayelana nokuthi izingxoxo zakho noJulian zithini?

[00:35:54] Sangeeta Waldron: What was interesting is Julian Lennon is a founder of an organization called the White Feather foundation. And they’ve been doing great work, pro planet work and connected the dots. So he’s been doing a lot of work with the upliftment of young girls because women are affected first, especially in the global south with climate change. And he also uses his own skills, which is photography and art, to portray and give a different insight into the climate conversation. And I think that’s really interesting because art and photography can convey so many different things.

Futhi usebenzisa eyakhe, ngingasho ukuthi ayikho leyo, uyazi, hhayi ukubukela phansi sonke lesi simo sosaziwayo, kodwa yena, unesikhundla sosaziwayo futhi usebenzisa elakhe, izwi lakhe kule nkundla. Futhi futhi, uyazi, kosaziwayo abaningi, lapho bekhuluma ngokushintsha kwesimo sezulu noma inkinga yesimo sezulu, bahlulelwa, bavalwe.

Ngakho akulula ngaso sonke isikhathi ukubeka ikhanda lakho ngaphezu kohlaka. Kodwa yena. Futhi ngicabanga ukuthi siyadinga, sidinga, ngangazi, ngicabanga ukuthi sidinga ukukushayela ihlombe lokho ngoba ababaningi abantu abazizwa benesibindi ngokwanele ukukwenza. Kodwa wenza imisebenzi emikhulu. Inhlangano yakhe yenza umsebenzi obalulekile futhi iwumsebenzi oyifa. Ngakho-ke akukhona nje ukuvala okukodwa. Bakha ifa ngempela futhi basebenzisana nenqwaba yemiphakathi yomdabu.

And again, it brings it back to, you know, these indigenous communities hold the wisdom of ecosystems. And again, it all links to one of the conversations I have in the science chapter and how science is now using the wisdom of indigenous cultures to fit the missing piece of the puzzle within their own scientific work. So, yeah, it’s fascinating.

[00:38:12] UJackie De Burca: Kuyajabulisa impela. Futhi-ke, ngicabanga ukuthi kukho konke okushoyo, Sangeeta, nalokho engikholelwa ukuthi uyikho, uyazi, uzophumelela ngencwadi yakho, ukhuluma neqiniso lokuthi kunenhlanganisela yokuphuthuma kanye ithemba okwamanje. Ukwazi kanjani ukulinganisa leyo mizwelo encwadini?

[00:38:31] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah, really good question. And I guess I will. I will answer this by going to one of the conversations I had in the book with a scientist, and I asked him, do you ever feel overwhelmed with what you’re seeing? Because scientists are also dealing with something called climate grief. And he said, I have hope and belief to make the changes that we need, because it’s the hope and the belief that will get us up every day to do the work that we need to do. And there is still a lot of potential out there to make the changes that we need. And that’s echoed throughout the book and throughout every conversation that I have, that there are parts of the world that actually have all the solutions, like places like Africa, that we’ve not really invested in and what the solutions they could be providing. So, yes, I mean, there is. I really have. After every conversation I had with different thought leaders, experts, I always felt, oh, my God, there is hope here. There is people actually doing stuff. And that is in itself, you feel part of a bigger picture. And there is a bigger picture.

[00:39:51] UJackie De Burca: Yebo. Bengizokubuza mayelana nendima yethemba, kodwa, ngiqonde ukuthi, usanda kuphendula lokho ngokuphelele ngokuphelele. Ngoba uma ngemuva kwazo zonke izingxoxo ezingama-36, uzizwe ngokuba yingxenye yesithombe esikhulu futhi udlala indima yakho nethemba lokuthi uyingxenye yazo zonke lezo, ngicabanga ukuthi lokho, uyazi, izindaba ezinhle kakhulu.

[00:40:10] Sangeeta Waldron: Yebo. Ngoba, uyazi, njengoba usanda kusho lokho, Jackie, futhi ukufingqa kahle, kungenze ngacabanga, akudingekile ukuba ube uchwepheshe wokudla, uyazi, usosayensi wokudla ukuze wenze umehluko. Iqiniso lokuthi wena. Sonke sivele siqaphele ukuthi esikuthengayo kusenza sibe yingxenye yaleso sixazululo sokuthi akudingeki ukuthi ube umbhali wezingoma ukuze wenze ushintsho emhlabeni. Iqiniso lokuthi silalela lowo mculo lisisiza ukuthi sizizwe sixhumene kakhulu nemvelo. Ngakho zonke lezi zinto zidlala indima futhi yonke into ixhunyiwe.

[00:40:41] UJackie De Burca: Yonke into ixhumeke ngokuphelele. Empeleni ngizobalula, ngenxa yokuthi sakuphenya ngokushesha, isisekelo Sosiba Olumhlophe yileso uJulian Lennon ahileleke kuso. Kubantu abalalele abangathanda ngempela ukujula olwazini lapho futhi, uyazi. , umsebenzi omuhle abawenzayo. Ngicabanga njengomuntu obhale incwadi hhayi. Hhayi kulesi sihloko, ngicabanga ukuthi ube nezinselelo zakho ngesikhathi sonke senqubo, Angita, zaziyini futhi wazinqoba kanjani?

[00:41:10] USangeeta Waldron: Umbuzo omuhle ngempela lowo, Jackie. Ngisho, bekuwukuthola isikhathi nabantu.

Also, when you’re writing the conversation, I felt, well, I’m sure all authors and all writers feel this. Journalists as well. You want to do justice to what you’ve written or the conversation you’ve had. You want that piece to be the best. And that’s hard because sometimes how you’ve interpreted a conversation doesn’t always mean that that person likes how they come across.

Ngakho-ke kufanele ususe i-ego yakho kuleyo nqubo. Ngokusebenzisa. Kwakuyinselele lokho. Uyazi, lokho. O, Nkulunkulu. Uyazi, abakuthandanga yini? Benze lezi zinguquko. Akukona ngami. Futhi kunjalo. Kumane nje, niyazi, ngenze okungcono kakhulu. Ngakho-ke akukhona ukuzizwa. Hhayi ukuzwa. Ukungabaza. Ungangabazi. angikwazanga. Ngangingafuni ukungabaza ngokwami ​​kuleyo nqubo, kodwa kunzima kakhulu ukungakwenzi.

Futhi, uyazi, ngithole encwadini yesi-4. Kuzo zonke izahluko, nginezingxoxo ezine ezihlukene encwadini. Kuningi okubhaliwe. Muningi umsebenzi. Futhi ngezinye izikhathi kwakubonakala kungapheli.

Ngakho kwakuyizinselelo, uyazi. Uyazi, uma abantu bebuya futhi bengeza izingcezwana ukuze bangezwa ukuthi balungisa umsebenzi wakho.

Lokho kungaba inselele ngoba, uyazi, ubhala inhliziyo yakho nomphefumulo wakho. Ezinye izinselele ukuthola isikhathi nabantu.

Abantu bayaphithizela ke. Yizo zonke lezo zinto nje. Futhi ngangibhala le ncwadi ngenkathi ngenza konke okunye. Ngakho-ke ukusebenza, impilo yasekhaya, ukupheka, ukuhlanza, uyazi.

[00:43:01] UJackie De Burca: Impela. Yebo.

[00:43:02] U-Sangeeta Waldron: Futhi ngezinye izikhathi ngangiba semgqeni wokubhala futhi kuzoba ngu-6:00.

[00:43:08] UJackie De Burca: Eshu, othile udinga ukudla isidlo sakusihlwa.

[00:43:10] USangeeta Waldron: Impela.

[00:43:10] UJackie De Burca: Ukwenza isidlo sakusihlwa. Impela.

[00:43:13] USangeeta Waldron: O, Nkulunkulu, ngisohlwini lapha. Angifuni ngempela ukuyeka.

Kuyoba njalo. Ngingathola usizo lapha?

Ngakho, yebo. Ngakho konke kwakunjalo.

[00:43:25] UJackie De Burca: Yebo.

[00:43:25] USangeeta Waldron: Ngicabanga ukuthi leyo bekuyinto enkulu kakhulu, uyazi, uyayenza njengoba usaphila futhi uqhubeka nempilo nomsebenzi.

[00:43:38] UJackie De Burca: Yilokho. Ngisho, akukho ukukugwema lokho. Kodwa njengoba ushilo izikhathi ezimbalwa phakathi nengxoxo yethu, Sangeeta, yonke into ixhumene. Ngakho-ke ngicabanga ukuthi lokho kudla okunikezayo futhi ngesikhathi esifanayo ukuthole emndenini wakho nasekudleni enihlala phansi nibe nakho ndawonye mhlawumbe kubuyela emphefumulweni wakho nasenhliziyweni yakho. Futhi noma ngazi njengomdali ukuthi kunjani ukwephulwa ekugelezeni kokudala, kubi. Kodwa ngendlela efanayo, cishe udinga ukususwa kukho ngezinye izikhathi besingeke sikwenze. Kunezikhathi lapho besingeke sikwenze ngoba sisohlwini. Kodwa cishe kukhona ingcosana yokondleka ngendlela yayo. Nakuba mhlawumbe kunzima at the.

[00:44:14] USangeeta Waldron: Isikhathi, uyazi, kuyiqiniso. Futhi uyazi, ngezinye izikhathi nawe. Bengithatha ikhefu bese ngibuyela emuva, ngiyacabanga, o, niyazi, bengingenza kangcono. Ngifuna leso sahluko sizwakale ngokwehlukile.

Ngakho-ke amakhefu mahle ngoba akunikeza isikhathi sokuzindla.

[00:44:30] UJackie De Burca: Yebo, ngivuma ngokuphelele. Ngivuma ngokuphelele. Manje, uma ubuyela emsebenzini wakho wangaphambili, izibopho zenhlalakahle yebhizinisi hhayi ubudlelwano bomphakathi, ingabe unomuzwa wokuthi iyincwadi ehluke ngokusobala, kodwa ingabe unomuzwa wokuthi wakhelwe phezu kwezindikimba zalo msebenzi noma cha?

[00:44:45] USangeeta Waldron: Yebo, kakhulu. Ngafunda okuningi kuleyo nqubo yokubhalwa kwaleyo ncwadi. Kodwa futhi izindikimba ziphinde zaxhunywa ngoba leyo ncwadi ibigxile emabhizinisini enza kangcono emhlabeni. Futhi ngihlola lokho ngendlela ehlukile kule ncwadi yamanje mayelana nendima yebhizinisi nokuthi isimo sezulu sinomthelela kanjani ebhizinisini kanye nezinguquko zokuhlinzeka, uxolo, uchungechunge lokuhlinzeka nezinsiza, izinto zokwakha. Kodwa futhi ukuthi isimo sezulu siwathinta kanjani amabhizinisi emhlabeni jikelele lapho abasebenzi bengase bangakwazi ukungena ngoba kushisa kakhulu noma indawo igcwele amanzi.

Yebo, abaningi kakhulu, uyazi, amabhizinisi manje athintwa isimo sezulu sangempela futhi esidalayo. Lokho kungabangela izinselele zokukhiqiza. Futhi nokuthi, niyazi, kungaba yibhizinisi elisebenza lapha elithembele kulo, angazi, into evela kwenye indawo eke yaba khona. Leyo ndawo ithintwe yisimo sezulu. Ngakho-ke abakwazi ukukhiqiza ngoba abazitholi izinto zabo.

[00:46:08] Jackie De Burca: Yeah, no, it’s a huge, It’s a huge topic. Now I’m about one hour south of Valencia and I went to the supermarket the day after the, you know, the biggest issue of the Dana and like it didn’t even occur to me that we see the effect of it here because I just wasn’t thinking like that. But all your fresh food was non existent. There was hardly any fruit and veggies. There was hardly anything in your meats, you know, because of course, yeah, Valencia is like a really important City to our area. We weren’t even thinking like that, but then that was kind of creepy to see. And then you realize that this is our new reality for the moment, you know.

[00:46:46] Sangeeta Waldron: Impela. Futhi si. Uma kungenjalo uma. Kodwa ngicabanga ukuthi sesizoqala ukubona ezinye zalezi zinhlobo zezinkinga ohlelweni lwethu lokudla ngoba ezinye izindawo zihlaselwa yisimo sezulu futhi singase singacabangi ukuthi kuzokwenzeka manje, kodwa nini, uma sibheka , uyazi, ngaphambi kwezinkathi zonyaka, sizoqala ukuqaphela umthelela walokho. Futhi bengifunda ndawana thize, ngenxa yezikhukhula eValencia, amawolintshi azoyindlala kakhulu.

Futhi singase singakuzwa lokho manje, kodwa sizokuzwa kwezinye izinyanga eziyisithupha.

[00:47:29] UJackie De Burca: Impela. Ngisho, sinomakhelwane emhlabeni, niyazi, abangabalimi. Bangabalimi bewolintshi. Futhi ukuqoqwa kwawolintshi kuyaqhubeka njengamanje. Kodwa omunye womakhelwane esibazi kahle, wathi emasontweni ambalwa edlule, kube inhlekelele ephelele kubo. Yebo.

[00:47:46] USangeeta Waldron: Uyazi, leso simo sezulu eValencia, kungenzeka singabi sendaweni yangakini, kodwa sinomthelela.

[00:47:53] UJackie De Burca: Yebo, besinesimo sezulu esifana kakhulu lapha, kodwa besingesihle kangako. Ngakho saba namaviki, amasonto namaviki afana nemvula enganqamuki. Ngakho-ke, bheka, kuthintekile futhi njengoba usho, lokhu kuyinto, owaziyo, ngeshwa okwamanje, cishe kuzofanele sibhekane nalelo qiniso kuze kube, njengoba mina nawe sithemba nabanye abantu abaningi engibakhulumayo. ukuze, zonke lezi zixazululo ezimangalisayo ezingase zikwazi ukuya endaweni zizongena endaweni. Ngakho. Ngakho-ke sizogcina ingxoxo ngokusobala ijabule. Okubalulekile, ngicabanga ukuthi, kule ngxoxo indima yencwadi yakho kanye nabanye abezindaba. Njengochwepheshe wezokuxhumana, u-Sangeeta, uzizwa kanjani ngendima edlalwa abezindaba ekuqhubekiseni ingxoxo yesimo sezulu?

[00:48:38] I-Sangeeta Waldron: Idlala indima ebalulekile futhi ikakhulukazi namuhla lapho uhlobo lwanamuhla lwenkathi yolwazi lapho yonke into ikhona manje, futhi sinolwazi oluningi oluyi-disinformation.

Ngakho idlala indima ebaluleke ngempela. Futhi indima yethu ukwenza isiqiniseko sokuthi sihlola yonke into esiyifundayo, ukuthi iwumthombo oyiqiniso ngoba kuningi okungamanga ngendlela esikwazi ngayo. Ngakho esikubonayo, esikubukayo, esikufundayo kubalulekile kulokhu nokuthi sizigcina kanjani sinolwazi kubalulekile. Futhi abantu bangazizwa bekhungathekile. Bacabanga ukuthi, o, izindaba zinjalo, uyazi, zimbi futhi zimbi. Asisafuni ukwazi. Kodwa-ke, uma uyeka ukubuka noma ukufunda izindaba, wazi kanjani ukuthi ungalwenza kanjani ushintsho noma okwenzekayo, uyazi, kuwubuqili njengamanje ngoba izindaba zicindezela kakhulu, kodwa thina kudingeka sihlale sinolwazi futhi sidinga ukugcina ukwaziswa ngemithombo eyiqiniso.

[00:49:58] UJackie De Burca: Yebo, lokho kubaluleke kakhulu. Manje, kusobala ukuthi uke washo ukuthi lezi zindaba zicindezela kakhulu futhi ngiyacabanga, uyazi, akekho odinga ukukuzwa usho ngoba uyazi. Kodwa uzizwa kanjani ukuthi incwadi izoba neqhaza kwabezindaba kanye nemiyalezo ngokujwayelekile?

[00:50:13] Sangeeta Waldron: Well, I’ve got a chapter in the book on media and I speak to some of the leading voices who work within the media, including an environmental journalist in Brazil and a local journalist here in London, and the role the media plays. But more than anything, the book gives people takeaways, little tips, suggestions that we can all do so we feel that we are making a difference, that we don’t have to, you know, I’m not saying we all become vegan and we no longer go on holiday and we just sit at home.

Incwadi ayikho leyo. Incwadi ithi usaphila kanjani?

Yenza izinto ozithandayo, kodwa ucabangela amaplanethi ngezindlela ezincane ngoba izindlela ezincane ezidala ushintsho. Futhi enye yezinto engikholelwa ukuthi uma siqala ukwenza lezi zinguquko ezincane, ziyakhula futhi ngaphambi kokuthi sazi, siyahlangatshezwa, senza izinto ezinkulu nezingcono. Futhi yilapho kudingeka sonke sibe khona, senze izinto ezinkulu, ezingcono, ezihlakaniphe kakhudlwana zeplanethi.

[00:51:33] UJackie De Burca: Ngicabanga ukuthi izinguquko ezincane zinganika abantu amandla, Sangeeta, akunjalo?

[00:51:37] Sangeeta Waldron: 100%. Ngiqonde ukuthi, futhi kungaba nje izinto ezinjengokwaziswa, uyazi, ukwazi amaqiniso kusho ukuthi usuka kokuthi wenza into enkulu futhi engcono.

Ukuthatha udoti wakho uye nawo ekhaya esikhundleni sokuwulahla phansi kuyisenzo esinenjongo kakhulu. Ukuba yingxenye yokulandwa kukadoti kwenza ushintsho. Zonke lezi zinto, uyazi, ukungathengi ipulasitiki engaka, ukunciphisa ipulasitiki yakho, ukucabanga ukuthi unganciphisa kanjani ipulasitiki yakho kwenza umehluko.

Zonke lezi zinto ziyahlangana. Ukunciphisa ukudla okudlayo, uyazi, kukwenza.

Ikwenza uhambisane kakhulu neplanethi. Ukwazi ukuthi yini ngesikhathi sonyaka, uyazi, ukudla.

Abantu sebekhohliwe ukuthi kusho ukuthini ukudla ngesikhathi sonyaka, yiziphi imifino nezithelo ezitshalwa ngaso sonke isikhathi sonyaka ukuze ukwazi ukukudla. Ngenxa yokuthi sonakaliswe kakhulu, sinama-strawberries unyaka wonke. Ama-Strawberries awakho unyaka wonke, uyazi, ngakho-ke ukwazi ukuthi yini enkathini. Bese kuthi-ke uma udla ngenkathi, empeleni. Futhi futhi encwadini, ngihlola kancane ngalokhu, kodwa empeleni uthuthukisa amasosha akho omzimba.

Unempilo kakhudlwana uma sidla ngesikhathi sonyaka.

Sihambisana neplanethi. Yebo.

[00:53:12] UJackie De Burca: Futhi kuzoba khona. Lokho kuyigugu kakhulu ngokwako. Futhi-ke uyazi, njengabanye abantu abathanda ukudla noma ukudla okudlayo uma uthanda, bangazi futhi ukuthi kungenzeka yini ukuthi lokho kutholakala endaweni kanye nokuba sesikhathini ngoba amandla alokho kudla azohambisana kakhulu indawo okuyo.

[00:53:30] Sangeeta Waldron: Ulungile? Yebo, 100% Jackie.

[00:53:33] UJackie De Burca: Ngakho-ke isihloko esithakazelisayo sisodwa ngempela.

Noma kunjalo, incwadi yakho, kusobala ukuthi inhloso yakho ukushiya abafundi begqugquzelekile ukuba benze okuthile. Uma bekunomlayezo owodwa, i-Sangeeta, othemba ukuthi uzothinta wonke umfundi ngemuva kokuwuqeda, bekungaba yini lokho?

[00:53:48] Sangeeta Waldron: Yiba ushintsho.

[00:53:51] UJackie De Burca: Uphelele.

[00:53:52] Sangeeta Waldron: Iphelele.

[00:53:53] UJackie De Burca: Kulungile. Ngakho incwadi izotholakala nini futhi izotholakala kuphi ukuze ithengwe?

[00:54:00] USangeeta Waldron: Yebo, abantu bangakwazi uku-oda incwadi manje.

[00:54:03] UJackie De Burca: Oh brilliant.

[00:54:04] Sangeeta Waldron: Yebo. Ngakho ungangena ku-inthanethi futhi u-ode ngaphambili ibhuku noma ngabe ukuphi emhlabeni.

Ungakwazi. Incwadi izophuma ngokusemthethweni ngomhla zingama-30 kuMasingana futhi izobe isitholakala kabanzi ezitolo zezincwadi, ezitolo zezincwadi ezibonakalayo futhi futhi ku-inthanethi.

Kodwa yebo, iyatholakala manje ukuze i-odwe kusengaphambili futhi ngithemba ukuthi abantu bayi-ode kusengaphambili futhi bayifunde futhi ngizothakasela kakhulu ukwazi ukuthi abantu bacabangani.

[00:54:41] UJackie De Burca: Ngakho-ke ngo-2025 kuzoba kuhle ukuthi, uyazi, uthole leyo mpendulo uma wazi kabanzi ngayo, lapho usunabantu abakunikeza impendulo. Uma ubunganikeza abalaleli iseluleko esisodwa ekupheleni kwale ngxoxo, ubashiye nemicabango yakho mayelana nokudala ifa elihle leplanethi, bekungaba yini lokho?

[00:55:01] USangeeta Waldron: Sangeeta, qala nje ngawe. Khohlwa ngalokho abanye abantu abakwenzayo noma abangakwenzi. Vele uqale ngeyakho. Futhi cabanga ngento eyodwa ongathanda ukuyenza elula kuwe futhi ivele ibuyele kulowo mcabango. Yiba ushintsho.

[00:55:18] UJackie De Burca: Kumnandi. Futhi kuqondile. Sangeeta, ngikufisela impumelelo enkulu ngencwadi. Nginesiqiniseko sokuthi kuzofika futhi impumelelo ibe, uyazi, abantu abaningi, abajabule abazoyifunda futhi bazibandakanye nayo yonke imibono ethokozisayo ekhona ngokusobala futhi bafunde kuyo futhi babe yinguquko, njengoba usho. ngokwakho.

[00:55:38] USangeeta Waldron: Ngiyabonga kakhulu uJackie, ngokuba nami nokuba nentshisekelo encwadini. Lokho kusho lukhulu ngempela futhi ngiyabonga. Ngiyabonga nje. Egcwele ukubonga.

[00:55:48] UJackie De Burca: Ngiyabonga. I-Sangeeta ibe yinhle kakhulu.

[00:55:52] Lawa Amazwi Akhayo.

.