S4, E3: What Is Your Legacy? Exploring Global Change with Sangeeta Waldron

Digitally Generated Transcript

[00:00:09] Jackie De Burca: I’m Jackie De Burca and today I have a very interesting episode with Sangeeta Waldron, who’s talking to us about her third book, “What Will Your Legacy Be? Conversations with Global Game Changers”.

And Sangeeta has spoken to 36 change makers. A really interesting and wonderfully diverse selection of people from around the world.

Some of the names may be familiar to some of you. But one will be almost certainly. This is Julian Lennon, who’s the son of John Lennon, but very much an artist and an activist within his own right.

I have so much admiration for Sangeeta’s work.

She has been integral in building the Constructive Voices brand, for which we are very grateful.

Sangeeta, it is a delight to be in conversation with you today.

[00:01:01] Sangeeta Waldron: Oh, me too, Jackie. And thank you for such a wonderful introduction and it’s great to be back in conversation with you.

[00:01:08] Jackie De Burca: Thank you so much, Sangeeta. So would you like to elaborate a little bit more on your career, you know, where you are to date, first of all, about your PR work and of course, then about your books.

[00:01:19] Sangeeta Waldron: Sure.

Not to sound or put anyone to sleep, but I’ve been over 30 years in communications and public relations work. I started out my career many, many moons ago writing speeches and briefings for a previous Prime Minister, UK Prime Minister and Ministers. I’ve worked for some of the most amazing brands, global brands. I worked for the first Mayor of London, Ken Livingstone. And in 2009, I set up my own PR agency, Serendipity. PR and Media. Serendipity is something I strongly believe in. And in 2009, when I set up the agency, the world was going through a global recession. And I thought, if I can survive this, then I can survive anything. And fast forward 2024. I’m still here and I’m thriving. And during that time, since 2009, I’ve written three books. My first book was on PR public relations and it’s called the PR Knowledge Book. And that’s a book that went to universities around the world and it’s still doing well. And it. Oh, God, you know, I can’t even remember timelines now. But in 20, well, during the pandemic or. Well, yes, during the pandemic, I published my second book, which is Corporate Social Responsibility is Not Public Relations.

And that’s a book all about greenwashing.

And that book was so timely. And relevant, and is still relevant into day’s conversations about what companies are doing and how companies are behaving. And that book was shortlisted for the Business book awards in 2022 and now in 2025, I will be publishing my third book on the 30th of January. And that book is a continuation of the conversation I had in my second book. And this one is looking at the climate crisis. And the book is called what will your legacy be? Global conversations with change makers. And I’ve interviewed 36 thought leaders, business leaders, community leaders from around the world. I have Julian Lennon in the book, I have a NASA scientist, a researcher who’s looking into humpback whales. So the book has got different themes and importantly, there’s a takeaway for the reader at the end of every chapter to hopefully create a more of a pro planet habit and mindset. So that’s me in a nutshell, Jackie.

[00:04:30] Jackie De Burca: So, Sangeeta, I think that was a wonderful introduction and I really appreciated it. It does give a good global view of your career and the books. And let’s just jump straight in now to your new book and please tell us, what will your legacy be? Conversations with global game changers about the climate crisis. What inspired you to write it in the first place, Sangeeta?

[00:04:55] Sangeeta Waldron: That’s a really good question, Jackie. And I have to go back to about a year and a half ago and my publisher Martin said to me, Sangeeta, let’s go for lunch. And he said to me, I think you’re ready to write your third book. And I said, you know what, Martin? I think I am right? I think I am ready because I’ve been thinking about some ideas and I really have been thinking about the climate crisis and what’s going on and how can we all make a difference. And that’s where the idea originated. And I really wanted to. I wanted to write a book where we could all take something away from it. So it’s not just talking about the climate crisis, but what can we all do, however simple, however small, that we can make a difference. Because I do believe we can all make a difference. And I’ll just say one more thing. People always say, what? What can I do? What can one person do? What difference can someone like me make? And I always say this, that, you know, one act can create a ripple and those ripples come together and together we can create a tsunami. And that tsunami can be a positive impact and be pro planet. So that was the actual thinking of the book.

[00:06:20] Jackie De Burca: I think, personally, it’s amazing that it came out of that conversation. But obviously your publisher knows you very well and was ready to, you know, that timing was perfect. And this had already been something that was developing, you know, in your heart and your soul and your mind and so on. The whole concept of legacy, Sangeeta, is central to the book, obviously. What is your personal take on legacy? What does it mean to you? How do you explain the concept for yourself?

[00:06:49] Sangeeta Waldron: Oh, that’s a really good question, Jackie. And I just want to say something. You said something just as you introduced this question, and you’re absolutely right.

It was all about the feeling, this. This soulful connection. I had this thinking, and I do believe every one of my books has its own energy and its own timing. So I just wanted to say that.

And legacy, to me is a very big word. And when I was interviewing people in the book, some people felt very overwhelmed with the word itself.

But for me, I think it’s just leaving the planet a little bit better than what I found it. And not just leaving it better for, you know, the next five, ten years, but for. For the next hundred years, the next 200 years, because that’s how we should be thinking.

And a good example of this is, you know, when you go to prime, when some people go to Primark or when some people go to some of these fast fashion outlets and they’ll buy a top and then they’ll think, okay, we don’t want that top anymore, and they’ll put it into landfill.

Sometimes. Invariably, those tops can take 100 years to break down because they are cheap and they’re made with plastic fibres. And so you think that is. That will be your legacy in the next hundred years? I don’t want my legacy to be that. I want it to be something more meaningful.

I want it to make a difference to somebody in the future with the air they’re breathing, with the. And I hope that they’ll still be able to tap into nature that we have now. So, yes, it’s something deep for me.

[00:08:52] Jackie De Burca: Yes, I think that’s very clear. From your work to date and obviously the new book that we’re discussing today, how did you feel it was received with the participants that you interviewed? Was it a bit too much for some of them initially? Was it something that was overpowering to them, or were some of them okay with it, the whole concept of legacy?

[00:09:14] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah, it’s really interesting because I ask everyone the same question, which is, what, will, what do you want your legacy to be? I asked them that at the end of every Conversation.

And some people, some voices were, oh, I don’t know, that’s a really big question, and just were. Felt quite overwhelmed by it. Some people weren’t because they felt they already were on their way to making a legacy and they wanted to continue their work.

But what was interesting is nearly with everyone, even those who said, oh, it’s such a big question, or those who said, you know, we want to continue. This is how we see it, everyone was very unassuming or, you know, felt very small in their contribution, which I found there was a lot of humility in their answers. And I found that very, I don’t know, strangely, very empowering. You know, there was no ego in this. It was really about just doing better and doing it well.

[00:10:29] Jackie De Burca: What a wonderful answer. So in a sense, it comes to me that of course, people who feel, oh, well, I’m not Julian Lennon or, you know, I’m not going to name all the other people, but I’m not somebody like that. So what chance do I have if people like that feel it’s such a big word. But in fact, what you said just there, Sangeeta, is. It is moving away from ego and just trying to play your part, whatever size that is, if it’s really small. But it’s part of an overall picture, isn’t it?

[00:10:57] Sangeeta Waldron: Absolutely, yes. And that was the feeling. I also felt I was part of something, you know, through their. Their humility. I felt I was part of that. I was part of something bigger than myself.

It was quite. It was an empowering feeling. And after every conversation I felt hopeful and everyone had hope and that and a belief that we can perhaps not change things, but we can find solutions to our problems.

[00:11:32] Jackie De Burca: Definitely. I think there are many very positive solutions out there being adapted in various places at the moment, and so much potential and possibilities. Now, obviously you worked with constructive voices on RPR in our early days, so you know us better than many other interviewees. Sangeeta, if you’re adopting the concept of legacy to the people who work in the built environment, how would you do it? Or would you change it at all?

[00:11:59] Sangeeta Waldron: I think there’s always room for improvement. That goes for any sector and we can always improve ourselves. But I think really for everyone on a. Working in construction, from the top to the bottom sideways, people doing all the admin stuff, that’s also really important in construction for everyone to just think, how can we just do it better for the planet? You know, can we use more sustainable materials? Can we think about our supply chain? Can we think about where we’re building and how we build within this local space. And in fact, in the book, I speak to somebody who works within the construction sector and she talks about all the amazing things that are happening that probably we as laypeople don’t know enough about or appreciate, such as Sangeeta.

[00:12:59] Jackie De Burca: So I’m fascinated just to dip into that because of our audience.

[00:13:03] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah. So things such as there is now, there’s an app, I believe, where people can actually, when they’re building something, a site they can actually track to see what’s the carbon footprint of that piece of wood or those bricks or whatever that their. That those materials are coming from. There’s a lot of thought now being put into the architecture of a building, whether it’s a school, a shopping complex, a housing site. There’s a lot of thought going into that. And also from the builders, the people working on the site, there’s a lot of thought going into how they’re approaching that build. So I think that’s really interesting because we. I didn’t really appreciate that enough. And whether it’s a big venue for music or a sports stadium, those buildings are being built with purpose and purpose for the community and for nature.

[00:14:09] Jackie De Burca: Yes, there’s certainly an awful lot of positive changes. Again, lots of different apps and all sorts of initiatives and some of the leading companies are really working with nature mind now. So there is a huge amount of change going on at the moment. I don’t know if you remember or not from one of the panels that you sat on for Constructive Voices in the relatively early days, a gentleman called Neil Maxwell. And I’d like to mention him purely because he is a lovely example of somebody who had a very, very successful company in the built environment doing fit outs, a chap based in Liverpool. And he was making lots and lots of money until he went on a voyage to the Arctic. And then he came back a changed man and he set up Changing Streams. I don’t know if you remember him at all.

[00:15:01] Sangeeta Waldron: Yes, I do.

[00:15:02] Jackie De Burca: So he’s a fantastic example of somebody who’s like, really taken on board what’s happening. And he, you know, he was making a lot of money out of his company. I think he sold his company eventually and he set up Changing Streams. And there earlier this year, they also launched Changing Materials, which by the name, of course, will give you the concept of the fact that, yes, they’re looking to build. They are building a resource for people within the built environment to find better materials for our environment and for nature. So there are so many things happening, Sangeeta, which is really positive. Obviously all the people you spoke to in the book, you had 36 different voices. They were very diverse, obviously impressive people, of course. How did you go about selecting those people and what sort of themes were you hoping to explore through their stories?

[00:15:55] Sangeeta Waldron: Well, I was very clear on the themes for the book. So I wanted to cover broad themes from science because that’s where everything starts within this climate conversation.

Leadership, global leadership, business, the world of business, food, because we all relate to that. We’re either shopping or, you know, we’re putting food on the table or we are, some of us are farmers, producers. So I wanted to explore food.

Media plays a big role and communities, of course, and then music and art because that’s also part of the storytelling within the climate conversation. So I have these themes and I also have a special chapter on India because it’s now the largest population in the world and it as a region, knows better than anyone about the challenges of the climate crisis. And so I had these themes and I also wanted to ensure that the book was filled with diversity and had inclusion. So diversity and inclusion of voice. So I wanted to make sure that we had, or I had as many female voices in the book and people from different communities and backgrounds. And when I couldn’t find a woman, then I would make sure it was somebody from a community or ethnic community to give that diversity of voice. Because one of the key things, especially in the developing world, which is hit by, well, they’ve been hit by the climate crisis for a very long time. You know, going back to the 80s, 90s, they were impacted. Now here in the west, we are being impacted by the climate crisis. But they were for a long time enduring what was happening. And what research shows is that women are the first to be impacted by any kind of climate calamity. Because invariably women are at home.

And so if it’s a tsunami or a drought, they are the ones impacted the most. So I really wanted to give that perspective in the book.

[00:18:21] Jackie De Burca: So it sounds like you worked incredibly hard just to achieve the diversity of voices for your 36 interviews.

[00:18:30] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah.

[00:18:31] Jackie De Burca: And then you had to write a book after that, obviously.

[00:18:34] Sangeeta Waldron: Yes. And also, you know, just looking at science, we, you know, science is very male dominated. So I really wanted to find female, find scientists. And I found two amazing, brilliant minds.

One is a NASA scientist and she’s Dr. Kimberly Minor and she works in the Arctic region as well. And the other is Roberta Boscolo, who. Yes, so.

Yes. So I’m really Pleased. I found nearly in every chapter a woman to give a perspective.

[00:19:16] Jackie De Burca: That’s fantastic. Now, I know this is not meant to be like a documentary of a couple of hours long, which maybe it deserves, you know, going into that level of detail perhaps at a later date when the book is actually released.

So it’s going to be hard for you to answer this question in a way, Sangeeta, but would you like to choose some of the most surprising or inspiring insights that you learned from your conversations?

[00:19:40] Sangeeta Waldron: I know tricky questions like to choose my best child. You know, what’s my favorite child?

I, you know, what I discovered and has stayed with me is the magic of humpback whales.

And I spoke to this researcher, her name’s Rachel. And just, I mean, I’ll say this because I want people to buy the book and read what she says. But what is extraordinary and what I’ve. I’ve learned during this process of writing the book is that nature has provided everything for us. She has thought of everything. Everything in our ecosystem has a function and has a place, and it works to keep things in balance, from the Arctic to the Antarctic, to marine creatures living in our ocean and our seas, to what, the trees on the land. And unfortunately, it’s been us humans who’ve gone in and disrupted the balance. But even a species like the humpback whale plays a very important part in our survival.

And I’ll leave you on that cliffhanger.

[00:21:03] Jackie De Burca: Definitely going to be reading the book. I would have done anyhow, in my case, because, you know, obviously I have a huge respect for your work, but, yes, that is a cliffhanger. Quite fascinating, obviously. The book includes interviews with personalities, as you’ve mentioned, ranging from the likes of, you know, Roberta Boscolo, who we both know, to musicians. And that means that there is such a broad range of perspectives going to be obviously there in the book. How do you feel that enriches the dialogue around climate change, Sangeeta?

[00:21:32] Sangeeta Waldron: Well, you know, as humans, we love stories. Stories is part of our DNA, and music and art are part of that. They’re that ingredient. And I speak to an art activist in the book, and she does these incredible drawings and paintings that really connects you to what’s happening in the seas and in the ocean. And I’ll just say this very quickly. I also speak to a songwriter. He’s called Stevie Kalinich, and he’s 80 years young, and Stevie used to write for the Beach Boys, songwriter for the Beach Boys. And he talks about one of his songs called Little Bird. And Again, it just shows you how music connects us with nature and the spirit of nature. And now the UN is also got lots of initiatives using musicians and artists to help us feel more connected to our surroundings.

[00:22:38] Jackie De Burca: That’s amazing. So I guess that probably leads us on very nicely to. I know you can’t pick favorite children out of 36, but let’s talk about the art and the music and what you know that’s so relatable to so many people. Even if they’re not artistically or musically inclined, most people enjoy some form of art or music. So what kind of takeaways do we have in the book from those particular areas?

[00:23:05] Sangeeta Waldron: Well, you know, actually music is going way back to. I say way back, not trying to date us. Jackie here.

[00:23:13] Jackie De Burca: Be careful, Sangeeta.

[00:23:16] Sangeeta Waldron: You go to the 50s and 60s, there is music there that was talking about climate change at that time, trying to get us connected, to be connected with nature and to think about our planet. So there’s lots of popular songs, popular music, and I actually have a list of some of those songs in the book. And, you know, even if you’re. If you don’t love art and you don’t like going to galleries, but I’m sure you’ll be reading something or you’ll see a photo of something, and those photos create feelings within us. And if. Imagine if you couldn’t go out and hear the rustle of tree leaves anymore or the sounds of waves, which is also music. It’s nature’s music.

And you couldn’t go out to your local park and kick a ball around or just walk in the park because it didn’t exist anymore. What would we be painting in the future? What would our art be? What would we portray on those campuses? And if we didn’t have music anymore, what would we be listening to on Spotify or the radio? It would just be silence. So I think there’s a lot of connection with music, art, what we’re watching, what we’re reading with nature. Nature inspires us.

And that’s also one of the key things I learn from these artists and these writers and songwriters is how much nature inspires them.

And through that, I hope will be inspired to make a difference to nature herself.

[00:25:07] Jackie De Burca: Certainly Sangeet. And I suppose what comes to my mind is to cover the people who don’t feel I’m not talented. Oh, I don’t really get art or I don’t even read books or whatever. But most people will look at. And we’re not going to mention another big brand here. But people will look at least movies and series on their television and adore and follow whatever ones that they’re really into. So in a way, I suppose if you start to take out the ingredients, like we just take for granted, the scenes that we see in a film that we love or in a TV series that we’re following, like X percentage of those are coming from nature. And if nature doesn’t exist any longer, the film that we love couldn’t have been made in the first place.

[00:25:51] Sangeeta Waldron: 100.

Yeah. What would we be looking at? A blank screen? Or would we be thinking, oh, my God, that’s how it used to be and this is now what it is.

Yeah. So we want to save those green spaces. We want to, you know, look after our parks. We want to take our rubbish home. We want to make sure we’re not filling our ocean and our seas with plastic. So otherwise it will be a very different kind of painting. But we’re actually seeing some of that being now written into our music and drawn into our art. How these things are changing the landscape.

[00:26:36] Jackie De Burca: Yes. Which is also really important, I guess, without having read the book so far, Sangeeta, one of the things that comes to mind is your gift of communication, the way you put the book together. Obviously, you’re very much inspiring your readers to become climate change aware. You’re not trying to drill, you know, down to lecture. It’s done through storytelling. Through storytelling with 36 different voices on yourself, bringing it all together and communicating it. What kind of practical steps do you feel individuals who read your book could adopt afterwards to contribute towards sustainability?

[00:27:17] Sangeeta Waldron: There’s so many simple, easy things for us to do. I mean, there are things that you don’t even have to, like, do. Do you know? It’s just one of the most important things we can do, which is what we’re doing now, between us, you and I is talking about it. Talking about the climate crisis and talking about it with others. Talk about it with your colleagues at work, talk about it with your classmates, your friends, because that raises awareness. And with awareness comes change.

Other little things you could do is when you’re brushing your teeth, don’t let the tap run, save water, because water is now becoming precious. Well, it is precious. And there’s statistics to say that we are slowly running out of water. So little things like that putting your lid on your saucepan will save water.

What else can I tell you? Even just going for a walk in the park connects you to nature and helps you feel inspired to make a difference. Taking your rubbish Home. Don’t leave it in the park. Think about not using a plastic bottle, but take. Take your own refillable water bottle. All these little things add up and make a difference.

[00:28:41] Jackie De Burca: They definitely do. Now, Sangeeta, going Back to your 36 subjects or interviewees in the book, do you feel that your readers will be surprised and inspired or shocked? What kind of emotions are you hoping to find from the readers in the future of your new book?

[00:29:05] Sangeeta Waldron: All of those things. Inspired, shocked. Oh, my God. I didn’t know that. I mean, I also speak to this retired lieutenant general to talk about how leadership is part of the climate conversation and how military tactics are being altered because of climate change. I mean, there’s so much in the book. There’s also about food.

When we go to this local supermarket, we might think, oh, mango is here. But how many of us do actually understand that when mangoes are in season and that mango that’s been nicely cut up and is in that lovely little bit of plastic packaging, what that carbon footprint is. So, yeah, so I’m just. Yes, there’s a lot to. Just for sure.

[00:29:57] Jackie De Burca: Now, you actually mentioned the former military leader who is there on my set of questions, because I really thought that is fascinating and I definitely would like to delve into that with you. Can you elaborate a little bit on that conversation? Because I think that’s very relatable to people also. Yeah.

[00:30:16] Sangeeta Waldron: So when I was writing the book, I mean, we had the. Well, we still have it going on and now we have, you know, the Ukraine and Russian conflict, and now we have what’s happening in the Middle east. And we don’t seem to understand there’s also an impact with war on the climate.

And so when I was writing the book, I thought, God, you know, I need to include something about what’s happening in the world right now. And it. I won’t sort of go into the detail, but there was a lot of serendipity that led me to talk to this.

[00:30:53] Jackie De Burca: Why am I not surprised? Sangeeta.

[00:30:58] Sangeeta Waldron: He. And it was really. And also when I was interviewing him that same day, the Guardian had this article about military tactics being changed by climate change, the climate crisis. So it would. It seemed really timely, really relevant. And I don’t want to have any spo. I don’t want to give any spoilers, but there are. The way the military is approaching themselves to be a solution to the climate. Climate crisis is surprising because what we don’t appreciate is tanks use fuel. All these arms have a carbon footprint. So the military is Also thinking of different tactics to reduce their own carbon footprint, which I thought was mind blowing because we don’t really, you know, just being on the outside, we don’t really appreciate that. And also how the Ukraine, well, the, the Russian conflict of what’s happening, how that’s also changing tactics and what’s happening in certain parts of the world.

And also leadership, you know, so how important leadership is within this, not just military wise, but also politically.

And all these things are connected and we don’t seem to think that they are, that they are, but they are. Certainly they’re all, there’s lots of dots being joined in this. And yeah, I also discovered that the military want to be seen, not just to be seen, to be doing right by the planet, but they really want to, they’re authentically thinking about it and making these changes and they have these green WhatsApp conversations going on.

[00:32:50] Jackie De Burca: Okay, that’s kind of cool.

That’s really, yeah, yeah, that’s really, really, really nice to hear. I suppose on a very basic level, if you choose to potentially fight for your country, well, then why you shouldn’t fight for Mother Earth? I suppose. Yeah.

[00:33:07] Sangeeta Waldron: And I, interestingly, I kind of have that question, but I frame it slightly differently in the book. You know, when you’re fighting for country, how does that, what does that mean? Because if you look at the uk, the king is very pro planet. Yes. You know, he’s, he’s dedicated his life being pro planet. And you could have a government that doesn’t seem very pro planet. So how are you as a military person? Are you conflicted? How does that work? You know, your government of the day might not be pro planet, but your, your, your monarch is.

So. Yeah, so I explore some of that thinking in the book.

[00:33:54] Jackie De Burca: No, but it does sound fascinating. Just going back to your point about fuel in the military. I literally thought yesterday we have a lot more small planes flying around where I am in Spain to check that we haven’t got fires because now is the burning season. This is the time of the year where farmers are allowed to burn whatever, you know, that they need, they feel they need to burn.

[00:34:16] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah.

[00:34:17] Jackie De Burca: And I literally had the same thought. I was like, that’s very nice that they’re, that they’re checking that we’re not going to, you know, go on fire. But the cost of the fuel of those vehicles that are doing that is, is also huge to the environment.

[00:34:32] Sangeeta Waldron: And I, I mean, we don’t have all the solutions yet, you know, and so we’re making the best of what we have.

So maybe in the future, I don’t know, maybe it could be drones or some other means.

It could be satellites to check. I mean, I’m, you know, technology is evolving all the time, but we shouldn’t just rely on the solutions to come from technology. It’s also got to be what we’re all doing as individuals. And I think that was one of the things that just going back to the military conversation is, you know, we forget military personnel are humans and they’re also, they’ve got families and they also think about the future and what legacy they’re leaving.

So everything’s connected, nothing is separate?

[00:35:31] Jackie De Burca: No. Now, I suppose given the list of names and we don’t want to have favorite children, but I suppose the name that most average people will know best is going to be Julian Lennon, the songwriter himself and also of course, the son of John Lennon. Could we at least have a little, a little chat about what your conversations with Julian brought up?

[00:35:54] Sangeeta Waldron: What was interesting is Julian Lennon is a founder of an organization called the White Feather foundation. And they’ve been doing great work, pro planet work and connected the dots. So he’s been doing a lot of work with the upliftment of young girls because women are affected first, especially in the global south with climate change. And he also uses his own skills, which is photography and art, to portray and give a different insight into the climate conversation. And I think that’s really interesting because art and photography can convey so many different things.

And he’s using his, I would say he’s not that, you know, not to undervalue this whole celebrity status, but he, he’s got a celebrity status and he’s using his, his voice in this arena. And it’s also, you know, for many celebrities, when they talk about climate change or the climate crisis, they are judged, they’re shut down.

So it’s not always easy to put your head above the parapet. But he is. And I think we need, we need to, I knew, I think we need to applaud that because not many people feel brave enough to do it. But he’s doing some great works. His organization is doing some really key work and it’s legacy work. So it’s not just a one off. They are really creating a legacy and they’re working with lots of indigenous communities.

And again, it brings it back to, you know, these indigenous communities hold the wisdom of ecosystems. And again, it all links to one of the conversations I have in the science chapter and how science is now using the wisdom of indigenous cultures to fit the missing piece of the puzzle within their own scientific work. So, yeah, it’s fascinating.

[00:38:12] Jackie De Burca: It is absolutely fascinating. And of course, I guess from everything that you’re saying, Sangeeta, and what I believe that you’re, you know, going to be achieving with your book, you’re addressing the fact that there is a combination of urgency and optimism at the moment. How do you manage to balance those emotions in the book?

[00:38:31] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah, really good question. And I guess I will. I will answer this by going to one of the conversations I had in the book with a scientist, and I asked him, do you ever feel overwhelmed with what you’re seeing? Because scientists are also dealing with something called climate grief. And he said, I have hope and belief to make the changes that we need, because it’s the hope and the belief that will get us up every day to do the work that we need to do. And there is still a lot of potential out there to make the changes that we need. And that’s echoed throughout the book and throughout every conversation that I have, that there are parts of the world that actually have all the solutions, like places like Africa, that we’ve not really invested in and what the solutions they could be providing. So, yes, I mean, there is. I really have. After every conversation I had with different thought leaders, experts, I always felt, oh, my God, there is hope here. There is people actually doing stuff. And that is in itself, you feel part of a bigger picture. And there is a bigger picture.

[00:39:51] Jackie De Burca: Yes. I was going to ask you about the role of hope, but, I mean, you’ve just answered that absolutely perfectly. Because if after all 36 interviews, you felt about being part of a bigger picture and playing your role and hope being integral in all of those, I think that’s, you know, that’s very positive news.

[00:40:10] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah. Because what, you know, just as you just said that, Jackie, and you beautifully summed it up, it made me think, you don’t have to be a food expert, you know, a food scientist to make a difference. The fact that you. We all just become conscious of what we’re buying makes us part of that solution that you don’t have to be a songwriter to make a change in the world. The fact that we’re just listening to that music helps us feel more connected to nature. So all these things play a role and everything is connected.

[00:40:41] Jackie De Burca: Everything is absolutely connected. I’m actually going to mention, just because we skimmed over it fairly quickly, the White Feather foundation is the one that Julian Lennon is involved in. For people who are listening who would actually like to delve into the knowledge there and, you know, the positive work that they’re doing. I imagine as someone who’s written a book and not. Not on this topic, I imagine you had your challenges during the whole process, Angita, what were they and how did you overcome them?

[00:41:10] Sangeeta Waldron: That’s a really good question, Jackie. I mean, it was finding time with people.

Also, when you’re writing the conversation, I felt, well, I’m sure all authors and all writers feel this. Journalists as well. You want to do justice to what you’ve written or the conversation you’ve had. You want that piece to be the best. And that’s hard because sometimes how you’ve interpreted a conversation doesn’t always mean that that person likes how they come across.

So you’ve got to remove your ego from that process. Through. That was a challenge. You know, that. Oh, God. You know, did they not like it? They’ve made these changes. It’s not about me. And it’s. It’s just, you know, I’ve done the best. So it’s not to feel. Not to feel. Doubt. Don’t doubt. I couldn’t. I didn’t want to doubt myself in that process, but it’s very hard not to.

And, you know, I have got in the book 4. In every chapter, I’ve got four different conversations in the book. It’s a lot of writing. It’s a lot of work. And it seemed at times never ending.

So it was the challenges of, you know. You know, when people come back and add bits and pieces not to feel they’re correcting your work.

That can be a challenge because, you know, you put your heart and soul into writing. The other challenges is finding time with people.

People are busy then. It’s just all those things. And I was also writing this book while I was doing everything else. So working, home life, cooking, cleaning, you know.

[00:43:01] Jackie De Burca: Exactly. Yeah.

[00:43:02] Sangeeta Waldron: And sometimes I’d be on a roll writing and it would be 6:00.

[00:43:08] Jackie De Burca: Oops, somebody needs to eat dinner.

[00:43:10] Sangeeta Waldron: Exactly.

[00:43:10] Jackie De Burca: To make some dinner. Exactly.

[00:43:13] Sangeeta Waldron: Oh, God, I’m on the roll here. I don’t really want to just stop.

So it would be. Can I get some help here?

So, yeah. So it was all that kind of.

[00:43:25] Jackie De Burca: Yeah.

[00:43:25] Sangeeta Waldron: I think that was the biggest thing is, you know, you’re doing it as you’re still living and carrying on with life and work.

[00:43:38] Jackie De Burca: That’s it. I mean, there’s no avoiding that. But as you’ve said a couple of times during our conversation, Sangeeta, everything is interconnected. So I guess that nourishment that you give and at the same time obtain from your own family and from the food that you sit down and have together probably feeds back into your soul again and your heart. And even though I know as a creative what it’s like to be broken from a creative flow, it’s awful. But in the same way, you probably need to be taken away from it sometimes we wouldn’t do it. There’s times where we wouldn’t do it because we’re on a roll. But there’s probably a little bit of nourishment in its own way. Even though maybe it’s hard at the.

[00:44:14] Sangeeta Waldron: Time, you know, it’s true. And you know, sometimes you. I would take a break and I’d go back, I think, oh, you know, I could do better. I want that chapter to sound different.

So breaks are good because it gives you time to reflect.

[00:44:30] Jackie De Burca: Yeah, I totally agree. I totally agree. Now, going back to your earlier work, corporate social responsibilities and not public relations, do you feel it’s quite a different book obviously, but do you feel you’re sort of built on themes from this work or not?

[00:44:45] Sangeeta Waldron: Yes, very much so. I learned a lot from that process of that writing of that book. But also the themes are again connected because that book was focused on businesses doing better by the planet. And I kind of explore that in a different way in this current book about the role of business and how climate is impacting business as well with supply changes, sorry, the supply chain and resources, materials. But also how the weather is impacting businesses around the world where the workforce might not be able to get in because it’s too hot or an area has been flooded.

Yeah, so so many, you know, businesses now are being impacted by the actual weather and that is causing. That can cause production challenges. And also that, you know, it could be a business operating here that relies on, I don’t know, something from another area that has been. That area has been impacted by a climate scenario. So therefore they can’t produce because they’re not getting their materials.

[00:46:08] Jackie De Burca: Yeah, no, it’s a huge, It’s a huge topic. Now I’m about one hour south of Valencia and I went to the supermarket the day after the, you know, the biggest issue of the Dana and like it didn’t even occur to me that we see the effect of it here because I just wasn’t thinking like that. But all your fresh food was non existent. There was hardly any fruit and veggies. There was hardly anything in your meats, you know, because of course, yeah, Valencia is like a really important City to our area. We weren’t even thinking like that, but then that was kind of creepy to see. And then you realize that this is our new reality for the moment, you know.

[00:46:46] Sangeeta Waldron: Absolutely. And we’re. If not if. But I think we’re going to be starting to see more of these kinds of problems in our food chain because other areas are being struck by weather scenarios and we might not think it’s going to happen now, but when, when we’re looking, you know, ahead in seasons, we’re going to start to notice the impact of that. And I was reading somewhere, because of the floods in Valencia, oranges are going to become more scarce.

And we might not feel that now, but we will in another six months.

[00:47:29] Jackie De Burca: Absolutely. I mean, we have neighbors on the, on the land, you know, that are farmers. They are orange farmers. And the orange collecting is going on right now. But one of the neighbors that we know quite well, he said literally a couple of weeks ago, it’s been a complete disaster for them. Yeah.

[00:47:46] Sangeeta Waldron: You know, that weather in Valencia, it might not be in your local neighborhood, but it has an impact.

[00:47:53] Jackie De Burca: Yeah, we had very, very similar weather here, but just not quite so dramatic. So we had weeks, weeks and weeks of like non stop rain. So look, it has affected and as you say, this is something that, you know, unfortunately for the moment, we’re probably going to have to deal with that reality until, as you and I hope and many other people that I speak to, all these amazing solutions that are potentially able to go into place will go into place. So. So we’ll keep the conversation obviously upbeat. The important thing, I suppose, of this conversation is the role of your book along with other media. As a communications professional, Sangeeta, how do you feel about the role that media plays in driving the climate conversation?

[00:48:38] Sangeeta Waldron: It plays a vital role and especially in today where today’s sort of era of information where everything is in the now, we also have a lot of disinformation.

So it plays a really important role. And our role is to make sure we fact check everything that we’re reading, that it’s an authentic source because there’s lots of misinformation as we know. So what we see, what we watch, what we read is critical to this and how we keep ourselves informed is important. And also people can feel overwhelmed. They think, oh, the news is so, you know, grim and terrible. We don’t want to know anymore. But then how, if you, if you stop watching or reading the news, how do you know how you can make change or what’s going on so it’s, you know, it’s kind of tricky right now because the news is so depressing, but we need to keep informed and we need to keep informed with authentic sources.

[00:49:58] Jackie De Burca: Yes, that is so important. Now, obviously you’ve said that the news is so depressing and I think, you know, nobody needs to hear you saying it because they know it themselves. But how do you feel book will contribute to the media and the messages in general?

[00:50:13] Sangeeta Waldron: Well, I’ve got a chapter in the book on media and I speak to some of the leading voices who work within the media, including an environmental journalist in Brazil and a local journalist here in London, and the role the media plays. But more than anything, the book gives people takeaways, little tips, suggestions that we can all do so we feel that we are making a difference, that we don’t have to, you know, I’m not saying we all become vegan and we no longer go on holiday and we just sit at home.

The book is not that. The book is how do you still live life?

Do the things you love, but you consider the planets in small ways because it’s the small ways that create change. And one of the things I do believe is when we start to make these small changes, they become incremental and before we know it, we’re met, we’re doing bigger and better things. And that’s where we need to all be at, doing bigger, better, wiser things for the planet.

[00:51:33] Jackie De Burca: I think the small changes can empower people also, Sangeeta, don’t you?

[00:51:37] Sangeeta Waldron: 100%. I mean, and it could just be things such as being informed, you know, knowing the facts means you’re just from that you’re doing a bigger and better thing.

Taking your rubbish home instead of just dropping it on the floor is a very purposeful act. Being part of a litter pickup is making a change. All these things, you know, not buying so much plastic, reducing your plastic, thinking about how you can reduce your plastic makes a difference.

All these things add up. Reducing your food waste, you know, makes you.

Just makes you more in tune with the planet. Knowing what’s in season, you know, eating.

People now have forgotten what it means to eat in season, what vegetables and fruit are grown in every season so you can eat. Because we’ve been so spoiled, we have strawberries throughout the year. Strawberries are not throughout the year, you know, so it’s knowing what’s in season. And then when you eat in season, you actually. And again in the book, I explore a little bit about this, but you actually boost your own immune system.

You’re healthier when we’re eating in season.

We’re in tune with the planet. Yes.

[00:53:12] Jackie De Burca: And there would also be. That is so valuable itself. And then you know, as some people who are into food or foodies if you like, would also know is if it’s possible that that’s locally sourced as well as being in season because the energy of that food is going to be more in tune with the area that you’re in.

[00:53:30] Sangeeta Waldron: Correct? Yeah, 100%, Jackie.

[00:53:33] Jackie De Burca: So it’s a fascination topic alone really.

Anyhow, your book, obviously your aim is to leave readers inspired to act. If there was one message, Sangeeta, that you hope resonates with every reader after finishing it, what would that be?

[00:53:48] Sangeeta Waldron: Be the change.

[00:53:51] Jackie De Burca: Perfect.

[00:53:52] Sangeeta Waldron: Perfect.

[00:53:53] Jackie De Burca: Okay. So when will the book be available and where will it be available to buy?

[00:54:00] Sangeeta Waldron: Well, people can pre order the book now.

[00:54:03] Jackie De Burca: Oh brilliant.

[00:54:04] Sangeeta Waldron: Yeah. So you can go online and pre order the book wherever you might be in the world.

You can. The book officially comes out on the 30th of January and then it’ll be available widely available in bookstores, physical bookshops and again online.

But yeah, it’s, it’s available now for pre order and I hope people pre order it and read it and I’ll be really fascinated to know what people think.

[00:54:41] Jackie De Burca: So in 2025 it’ll be great to, you know, get that feedback when you know more about it, when you’ve had people give you the feedback. If you were to give one piece of advice to listeners at the end of this conversation, leaving them with your own thoughts about creating a positive legacy for the planet, what would that be?

[00:55:01] Sangeeta Waldron: Sangeeta, just start with yourself. Forget about what other people are doing or not doing. Just start with your. And think about one thing you would like to do that’s easy for you and it just comes back to that thought. Be the change.

[00:55:18] Jackie De Burca: Fantastic. And so straightforward. Sangeeta, I’m wishing you so much success with the book. I’m sure it’s going to come and success being, you know, the more people, the merrier who are going to read it and engage with all the fascinating perspectives that are obviously there and learn from it and be the change, as you say yourself.

[00:55:38] Sangeeta Waldron: Thanks so much Jackie, for having me and for being interested in the book. That really means a lot and thank you. Just thank you. Filled with gratitude.

[00:55:48] Jackie De Burca: Thank you. Sangeeta has been absolutely wonderful.

[00:55:52] This is Constructive Voices.

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